Couple of Thoughts on Airbnb

[Christopher64]

Hi, I have been a regular Airbnb guest user for several years. I've noticed some trends occuring in the last year or two, that for me have changed my attititude about the service. I think it's a fantastic resource overall. But I'd just like to voice my two concerns and solicit some friendly opinions. Because, I'm only one perspective, myself. 

1) Recently I looked at a studio in a scenic town in a mountain state. It was $65/night, which is totally fine. However, there was a $50 cleaning fee. Then a $30 service fee (Airbnb's cut), then a $24 occupancy tax. What was a raw rate of $195 for three nights became a total of $299. This strikes me as a rather excessive amount of add-ons? I realize it's not centralized effort - each entity adds on their fee as necessary. But it changes the overall picture for the user, and the decision making process. I understand fees, but it just seems excessive amount to have to factor as a burden on the guest side of the equation. $299 is a heck of a lot more than 195. 

2) I have noticed that using Airbnb in other countries is significantly less expensive than in the U.S. Significantly. Which leads me to a broader philosophical point about hosts who want to capitalize on their extra space/property, vs the opportunity to inflate and gouge guests. The word "greed" comes to mind, but I don't want to make as much of a negative accusation about hosts. And I completely understand the market forces at play, the price will be what the market will bear. But I have noticed even in remote towns, not big cities, average nightly rates well above $100, 200, and I'm thinking, does it really need to be *that* expensive? People use Airbnb in part to avoid the excessive costs of a hotel. But Airbnb rates in the US seem to be skyrocketing. I have used Airbnb in Europe quite a lot, and it is a joy because people are not trying to always push the limits of how high they can charge. Rates are attractive and easily affordable. Just sayin'

Thoughts?  

[Lawrene0]

Can't comment on #1, @Christopher64, since I have not had to pay or charge an occupancy tax, and I don't pay, if I can help it, or charge a cleaning fee. But as to #2, I can add a "listen, kids, in my day..." In the mists of time, before Airbnb, there were B&Bs. Still are, I've heard it said. 😉 Back then, they were a wonderfully cheap way to travel in Britain and a shockingly expensive one in America. So it's not new?

The cool thing is that we all can find all levels of comfort and cost here. Thanks for the thoughts.

[Lois-and-Darryl0]

@Christopher64:  You are very right!  The Guests are being reamed.  I spend time a couple days a week reading and learning on this Community Center platform, and I can say that a lot of Hosts here have complained - on the Hosts Voice too - that the burden of Airbnb's fees are unfairly placed on the Guests.  It isn't fair that I am only charged $12 or $15 for a stay, when the Guests are charged many times that amount just for Airbnb's charges.  So, yes, many Hosts here recognized and talked about this problem.  And I feel our review system and our own reviews may also be impacted by this.  Now that we have a "Value" rating, I've been rated lower than 5 stars twice for my value - and our home is a GREAT value!  But, the Guests see their whole bill and not just the nightly fee.  This is the reason why we have removed our cleaning fee.  We raised the nightly rate (not enough to cover the loss of the cleaning fee), and so we net less than we did last year.  I do like the idea of incorporating the extra costs of cleaning the house into the fee.  I believe that if Airbnb would listen to the Hosts on this platform, they would have done something by now to make this process a bit more equally distributed.  They must be pretty busy.  Or, the alternative, which I don't like to think about.  Good Luck!  Lois & Darryl

[Christopher64]

Lois & Darryl, Yes thank you for the input. Goord to know it's an issue that is being discussed. At least I'm not crazy in complaining a little bit. I do not know the channels for communicating these issues directly to Airbnb, but I hope they are aware and that they listen to their users, both guests and hosts. Even just the example I mentioned in my OP is quite ridiculous, and that was just for a studio for one or two people. I can imagine an even greater increase if you're renting a whole house or a larger apartment. Hundreds of dollars extra in fees and taxes. And interestingly, except for Airbnb fees, there are no other fees (that I can remember off the top of my head) when using Airbnb in other countries. So in Europe for example the nightly rate is pretty close to the final total, which is fine.

[Scott95]

Hi Christopher,
I'm one of those European hosts. I include everything in my price. If I don't, if feels to me like I"m cheating. when I go someplace, I want to know what it is going to cost me, and that's really all I need or want to know about the cost. I don't like haveing to search for extra costs, inclulding taxes. I include guest tax, sales tax, all breakfast costs; the tiny amount of service fee from airbnb is the only thing I don't include.
Having said that, I dont go to places that do the kind od thing you brought up. If people are willing to pay for that, it's fine with me.  For me, though, I like to spend time with my guests and by the end of their visits, I always feel like I have learned something. That is what I like when I travel.
I love traveling, but it is hard.  I'm retired now and the bnb gives me a bit of extra money. I like that.  What I like more, though, is that I feel like I have many of the advantages of travel, but all I have to do is clean and make breakfast.
The p;us is that I actually get to talk with people whose lives are very different than mine.  That was always what I wanted to do when i vacationed, but it is hard to do outside of a work or airbnb experience.
What bothers me about all of this is the lack of connection that I hear many of my guests are finding. Eventually, I think that everyone will gravitate to their own idea of what this should be, and those who agree will go to the places they want, and pay what they think is reasonable.
To me, this is an amazing experiment that has worked well. There are problems, but genreally we have the ability to do what we want to do as individuals, and airbnb is the catalyst that allows us to find what we need and want.
I appreciate so much your post. It mirrors some of the thought I have been thinking about recently.

[Alexandra224]

Hello christopher!:

1) Indeed i agree, i myself am a host in Mexico ( in Merida city to be exact), and i agree with this point, it seems excesive to me when i travel around and see like a great spot with a great price, but then when i keep looking for fees, the price goes up to the moon, being sometimes the same as a cheap good 2 stars hotel. 

Why?, there are some "Airbnb masters", or people who are in the bussines serious of short term rental( and i believe i'm too) saying, that it's better to have low prices for the room, but then charge a little extra more for fee like cleaning.. because at the end people like to pay them because makes them feel like it's actually going to be clean.  But honestly it depends on your property, and i definitely feel there are some people charging excesive amounts of money for this fee equivalent to the nightly price, which its insane. and when some of them ( MOST) clean the space themselves, so its another fee they earn, and not they actually pay to someone.

2): I also agree in this one, i've used Airbnb in so many countries, and i must say US, it's the most expensive one, why?, because i do believe TONS of people are trying to use their extra space to rent it on Airbnb so they can cover apartment rent for themselves, which it's okay, it's a way of paying your own bills, when it becomes kinda wrong, is when you try to rip off everything to pay those expenses, and that your space doesn't actually deserve the amount of money you are charging.. but at the end is no one faults, because even tho they are charging excesive and dumb amounts of money.. (i've seen $100 for a night and small room), people are still paying it.. if people did not pay it, they would have to lower their price.. so, it's both sides story..

The thing, is Airbnb even tho it started as a way of have an income, or make new friends,, now it's a short term rental bussines, so owners are treating it like it, raising their prices to the top..

my regards!

[Christopher64]

Hi Alexandra, Great to hear I am not crazy with these thoughts! I understand everything you mentioned, makes sense. People can charge a lot more, so they do, they want to profit as much as possible and cover their mortgage perhaps. It's very, very much more expensive in the U.S. I can rent an apartment in Paris for a month for very reasonable prices, but anywhere in the US, forget it. I think it has to do with American capitalism - it's all about profits and money and getting the most you can.

Another odd example, I went to Puerto Rico last year and in the town we visited, there were only a few Airbnb options. We took a room in a house for $100/night, which was insane. We did it because we had to reserve something, but I was annoyed by it. A little plain house in the middle of nowhere, bad internet, grubby conditions, sharing space, for $100. The hosts were American expats. I am much more careful now about what I reserve. Been to Merida, love it there!

[Alexandra224]

Yes! life up there it pretty expensive compared to here Mérida!, you know that since you been here then!!!, but i don't agree with pricing with crazy amount of numbers!, i get pretty jealous of knowing how much they charge per night .. compared to mine Hahaha, some of them are worth it.. others not at all.. i hope this changes and people be congruent with their prices :S

Greetings from merida!!!, if you come back anytime let me know! 

[Jeannette27]

We host in Ensenada , Baja, and I just learned of the extra charges from Airbnb to the guests.  I had no Idea!  And I don't know how to let the guests know ahead of time of the extra charges.

Re cleaning fees:  we charge $40 because it's a very large house and even if they only use the master suite, there is  more cleaning than normal and we have a cleaning crew that we hire.

[Annette33]

@Jeannette27 , you don't have to let your guests know about pricing: they will get an itemized statement when they are ready to book. Everything is clearly spelled out before they book.

The extra charges are always the Airbnb service fees to guests (5-15%), then if appropriate, occupancy taxes that Airbnb collects on behalf of your guest in certain markets.

[Jeannette27]

Thank you, Annette.  I'll stop fretting.

[Robin129]

I don't know that a one time cleaning fee of $50 is that much for a studio. Consider what is involved:

Standard Cleaning in all rooms:

Dusting:

1. Picture frames
2. Knickknacks
3. Ceiling fans
4. Lamps
5. Furniture
6. Woodwork
7. Shelves
8. Baseboards
9. Vacuum carpets
10. Vacuum furniture including under any cushions
11. Empty and clean ashtrays and wastebasket

Standard Kitchen Cleaning:

1. Appliances
2. Counters
3. Cabinets
4. Table and chairs
5. Range top
6. Refrigerator
7. Microwave (inside and out)
8. Clean and sanitize:
9. Sinks
10. Countertops
11. Backsplashes
12. Floors

Standard Bathroom Cleaning:

1. Mirrors
2. Polish chrome
3. Clean and sanitize:
   1. Shower
   2. Bath tub
   3. Sinks
   4. Vanity
   5. Backsplash
   6. Toilet
   7. Floors
   8. Tile Walls
   9. Floors

Then there is laundry for linens and towels .. stuff. But, yes, some of the other fees seem high. As far as other countries, is it really a fair comparison? The US has a lot of taxes other countries don't, the general cost of living in the US is much higher than many other countries. And, yes, there is some truth to the "greed" factor. Some hosts also price higher to encourage a certian class of guests. Fair? Maybe not, but it is what it is. 

I have one room I share. I won't get $85 per night, but I hope to get it higher than $18. 

[Christopher64]

Hi Robin, Thank you for your comments. I take your points, but I still have to disagree. For a studio or one bedroom that is turning over every few days, is the owner really dusting every surface? They are dusting picture frames? Shelves? Woodwork? Polishing chrome? Cleaning tables and chairs? Mopping every floor? Gimme a break. They are doing the laundry, cleaning surfaces, sanitizing what is necessary, doing some dishes maybe and tidying up. Of course that is some work, and it may be a more thorough cleaning if it is a larger space and if a group comes in and parties hard and it needs a better cleaning. I can understand that more. But for a basic little room, or studio, I do not imagine that everything you mention is being cleaned like that. 

Secondly, the US is not a higher cost of living than Germany or France, or siginificantly higher depending on the area. I can rent a small apartment in Paris or Hamburg for a month for a VERY reasonable rate, while in the US this would be outrageous, the rates would be astronomical. If you're talking southest Asia, everything there is cheaper with the exchange, so you are correct there. But not in western Europe. 

[Robin129]

If the host is paying someone to clean the rate will not change just because they cleaned it yesterday. I don't know the particulars of the stay you used for the example, I am speaking in generalities, as you cannot blanketly say all Airbnb hosts charge excessively. There is so much to consider with exchange rates, costs of living, government fees and taxes, and individual tastes. There is a survey on cleaning charges.  Look it up and read some of the comments. Many, many hosts clean their hosted areas just like and often times better than quality hotels clean.

If it takes me three hours to clean between guests, and a living wage is $15, that is $45 by itself. So, reasonable cleaning fee is subjective.  

[Dee9]

@Robin129

so youre paying yourself to clean?

why not just add $5/night to your listing?

if a guest is only staying 1 or 2 nights an extra $50 is a lot - considering youre not paying an outside cleaning company