Funding Damage Claims

[Robin4]

I realised from posts just like one I just read from Lisa in Chelsea MA that have been circulating here on the forum since I became an active host in 2015, that I could not rely on support from Airbnb if a hosting turned sour.

There is a possibility that I might get something but, the probability is that, that something may be less than 20% of what I was claiming. 

I, at that point, upped my hosting price by $6 per night and put $10 per hosting night into a 'damage' account. There is currently over $1,860 sitting in that account, earning interest....at one stage it was well over $2,000, but I have had to make a couple of claims on it.

Nobody argues the point with me when damage is done....I don't have to go through the hassle of abusing the guest, submitting a claim, potentially loosing a reservation until the damage has been assessed and then getting a pittance offered to me by CS.....why would you put yourself through that?

I am insured for public liability and major occurrences like the building burning down, but I have a $3,000 excess to keep the premium really low.  Minor things like a broken microwave or a lost key, I just go to Kmart and buy another microwave for $45.00, I go to Bunnings and buy another lock, about the same cost....an hour later I am back in business....no hassle, no agro, no let-downs! And Airbnb thinks I am ace because I don't expect them to be anything other than a booking platform...I have never approached them with a damage claim....and, I never will!

I just fix the problem and get on with the business of hosting! In short, it is money I would not have otherwise had, so, I win on all fronts.

We as hosts need to understand we are running a business and it is up to us to make sure we run that business in a professional way and that includes insuring our risk.

I would ask hosts to please do not expect Airbnb to be our 'fairy godmother'...they aren't, they are simply a booking platform. Like Fred I would dearly love to see Airbnb get rid of this sham business of lottery win compensations if things go wrong.....It's never going to happen, and believe me, I have seen a lot more of these problems across this computer keyboard than you have.

Hosts, please do what you do well, host...... and let Airbnb do what they do well, book guests!

Don't expect something that will in all probability, let you down!

Cheers.....Rob

[Robin4]

Yeah Dustin, you don't get any argument from me, you are right....if they tell you they cover you then they bloody well should! 

But the issue is, this is marketing! As you rightly say, it attracts hosts to the platform! Where the problem comes in Dustin, their idea of coverage and ours are entirely different, and we choose to read something into their offering that does not exist.

Let me put it to you another way Dustin, you decide you want to go from Pittsburg to LA!

You could book a flight and on the required day rock up to the terminal and you could be there in LA in 5 hours. You have paid your money for a certain service and you have got it....ok.

XYZ Trucking company also does runs from Pittsburg to LA and each day they are prepared to take a passenger along. Carting passengers is not their core business but they are prepared to offer it. There is going to be a few stopovers, the truck may strike an issue and can't take you all the way to your destination....but hey, they were not charging you airline rates to do a specific task so, you get what you get!

Airbnb are not offering you insurance coverage, sure they tell you they 'have your back covered'....and in many instances they have! But what they are offering is an arrangement that will provide an adjudicated settlement in certain instances, and I am not saying you are wrong in expecting something more Dustin....I am saying Airbnb are wrong in offering it, so don't depend on it. Look after your own interests!

Cheers.....Rob

[Branka-and-Silvia0]

@Robin0 I agree with you 50% ... of course we wouldn't ask for a few $ damage but if a damage is more then a nightly price then a guest should pay for it. And that is why security deposits exist. The problem is - hosts don't hold security deposit, Airbnb does and it sides with a guest.

So the question is - why security deposit? Why host guarantee? If hosts always have to pay from their pocket?

You are live in host ,  Fred has an island and his guests knows he will be present on check out,  so both of you have a controll over your property. But off site hosts in Las Vegas or New York or any party destination ... they host different kind of guests and their property is in danger every single day.

If Airbnb is just "a booking site " then hosts should be allowed to collect and keep the security deposit by themselves .

Airbnb is not just "a booking site" ... it is a mediator,  judge and jury and pretend to be an insurance company

Btw, we are not insured because to make a damage claim from Croatian insurance agencies is as painfull as from the Airbnb.

[Deborah393]

Airbnb, actually ,does not really charge the Security Deposit, the host thinks they do but they inform the guest that they do not. Its simply a comercial competataive approach. The guest ultimately has no risk within the Airbnb system which openly competes with other portals that do acatually materially charge a  host nominated security deposit.

[Fred13]

   I doubt Airbnb fathomed how their business was to become, or what types of listings they would be having today. Also, in all likelihood, I doubt they forsaw the many creative ways hosts would be using Airbnb; i.e. individual people making a major investment in a home for the sole purposeto be listed in  Airbnb, multiple-listings by an absentee owner, or even the commercial property-management companies jumping on the bandwagon, as you read here so often.

    So, different properties have come to Airbnb for different reasons, with the original 'sharing of your funky home' not being the only model any more.  The end result then is that today's Airbnb properties do differ greatly in intention, host ability, cost to build, security, likelihood of damage, type of guests they even draw, etc etc. Heck, today only 20% of Airbnb are even in the US.

   Imagine if all hosts throughout the world in 191 countries are expecting and insisting to be covered, by the same policy, in exactly the same way. That would be a laughable assumption in the real insurance world, where they have different policy costs for different risks. Surely, the likelihood of a claim in a dwelling that is simple and 'bullet proof' vs some delicate $1 million dollar personal place resembling a China closet is totally different; surely a host being 'there' versus in some far away place on the other side of town, country or planet trying to run multiple properties is a totally different reality than the original granola single model.

  @  Branka & Silvia, you said: " Airbnb is not just "a booking site" ... it is a mediator,  judge and jury and pretend to be an insurance company"

   We know what it is, our point is that is exactly what it should NOT be, and to stop pretending to be a property insurer, with a general policy that makes no sense for probably most because it has become so strange how it is capriciously applied. Because of this whole absurdity, perhaps a host oftentime is better off 'thinking' of Airbnb as no more than being a 'booking agent'.

   Now here is a noble idea: Give hosts the option NOT to be part of the Host Guarantee program, and deduct .5% (or what is really costing every host) from their hosting fee. 

[Robin4]

@Fred

Fred I was with you all the way until you mentioned deducting .5% from the host service fee!

That's about the most fanciful thing I think I have ever seen you write!

Cheers......Rob

[Fred13]

Like I said - it is an 'idea'.

And while playing with ideas, look at it the other way; leave fees as they are, but charge an 'extra' fee for Host Guarantee, and then for Airbnb to do start applying it as a true insurance.  Don't give it out for 'free' (supposedly, nothing is for free really) and then make it the antithesis of good will with hosts.

[Robin4]

@Fred,  I can't see them putting themselves over a barrel by doing that Fred. At moment it's free so, don't complain! Once they start charging a premium they become subject to trade practices legislation and a whole raft of liability laws and they loose the ability to adjudicate decisions.

I am with you though Fred, just give the whole host protection thing the boot and stop succering hosts into living in a fools paradise!

Cheers.....Rob

[Fred13]

Aye Robin; just trying to think of 'something' to help circumvent this ridiculous present host-Airbnb claim battles.

[Branka-and-Silvia0]

Fred , this claim battles wouldn't exist if hosts could take a real security deposit.

[Fred13]

A 'true' Deposit System in Airbnb, may not be the panacea it normally it could mean, they will still decide who is awarded what and what amount it can be, and considering their past history of how much they lean toward the guest, it may not turn out to be a permanent solution. 

[Fred13]

Btw Robin, the Airbnb Host Guarantee is not free, oh not at all. The fact it is still there, is no guarantee it is still 'free', nor to the same degree as once it may have been the case, relatively speaking. Note that hosting fees have gone up in the last year, it stands to reason that claims by hosts are part of the reason. Litigation fighting local ordinances must be surely another.

[Rebecca181]

I charge enough a night to ensure that I don't have to sweat 'the small stuff'. And, I screen well - I have had amazingly few damages, something I am truly grateful for. Even my white linens are still in good shape! I also live on-site, which of course helps.

What I DO have a problem with is the 'bait-and-switch' aspect of the Host Protection Guarantee that is loudly advertised by Airbnb. It appears designed to lure new homeowners into listing with Airbnb, soothing any doubts they may have about inviting strangers into their home, which, for some of us, is our 'safe haven', and, our primary asset. Specifically, Airbnb claims that homeowners listing with them will experience 'Peace of mind' because of the Host Protection Guarantee. Anyone reading these forums know that this is a crock of crap.

They need to get rid of this distorted reality and let us have access to a *real* damages deposit. I say *real* with asterics because, here again, new hosts enter in a deposit number that they assume they will have access to if there are damages (as with most any other booking site). Surprise, surprise - it is only a phantom deposit! Airbnb is maturing to the point where they do not need to use such juvenile, used car salesman tactics to entice homeowners to list with them. Because it serves no one, in the end.

[Fred13]

Precisely. Perhaps what they need to also do is get off the vertical ladder of expansion and hand back control to hosts over their own affairs. 

[Rebecca181]

Now THAT'S a thought. If Airbnb truly wanted to be bold and innovative in regard to the 'handling' of their hosts, they would indeed hand the controls back to us. If they did this, I predict that host satisfaction (even happiness) with Airbnb would greatly increase. The changes need not be extravagant - Just a few tweaks and we would feel like valued, respected partners versus mindless children with no business sense. 

The main adjustments / changes I'd like to see is:

1) The ability to block reviews from disgrunteled guests who violated house rules and are retaliating against a host with the intent to harm them, versus providing a relevant review, and

2) The ability to have an actual damages deposit that can be drawn from if damages can be proven. And the proof need only be reasonable. Not having a 'licensed Chair expert' give a report on what it costs to repair a chair (no such job title exists, yet this is what one host here was told to do by Airbnb when trying to make a claim. Beyond silly), and

3) The ability to decline bookings that are obviously not a match for our listing and/or our house rules without being penalized, and

4) The ability to deny 'support' animals if we are a private homeowner

There's a few more changes I'd like to see, but these are the ones that matter most to me. And, I already have the ability to do items 2 - 4 with VRBO and Trip Advisor. And, were I ever to get a low star review with VRBO or Trip Advisor, I will NOT receive warnings and threats that I may be de-listed. It is up to the prospective guest whether they choose to book or not, based on reviews. If Airbnb wants VRBO and Trip Advisors listings and business - which they obviously do (the vacation rental market, especially) - they may want to consider making the terms for owner / hosts equally attractive. 

[Maureen175]

I had an experience with a guest last night that comes under this topic. These guests took showers that were 40 minutes in length. They arrived and started running water and it didn’t stop until 3 o’clock in the morning. Besides keeping me awake all night. I wrote to them this morning when the water started running again,  I was so worried that they would continue to use water like crazy and they’d blow out my septic system. I live in the country outside of city limits. But even if I lived in the city limits water isn’t free. If  guests want to take 40 min showers that’s crazy right? 

When I wrote to say I was very worried, their response was to say how unhappy they were with their surroundings and they had no idea what a septic system was.  

If they blow out the septic system I’m out tens of thousands of dollars. There is no fixing a busted drain field. It takes backhoes and thousands of dollars.

I limit the the guests that can stay here because of the septic system. I was taken aback that they don’t know that not everyone has sewer systems and that 40 minute showers are not good anywhere. 

I’m new to air B&B I’ve had a vacation rental but I managed it myself. I thought this would be easier. 

‘Now I wonder. 

‘Thanks for being a source of knowledge in this ea of humanity.