Had a guest who accepted the rules, booked and disputed the rule and Airbnb sided with guest

[Lucas18]

Had a bad guest plain and simple.  The guest in particular accepted the rules. One of the rules was to pay the cleaning fee and the amount was disclosed at the time when he was booking. He accepted.

The guest asked for a discount which I accepted provided certain conditions were met. Well they were not met.  The guest opened a dispute and mentioned that the price was unreasonable. Airbnb did not ask any kind of prove mind you from me our the guest, but one of the arguments he used was the unreasonable charges. I repeat prior to accept the booking he read the rules and all fees were listed.

At the End AirBnb sided with the guest and explained to me the the price was unreasonable.

These are the problems that I and the owner have:

1)  The Guest accepted the terms and conditions, thus he is liable for those.

2) Since when Airbnb can overturn the terms and conditions ? Aibnb response was at best absurd. They stated the price charged was too much. Well, the Guest had the option to book with someone else. Airbnb allowed the Guest to breach the terms and conditions one of the trusting pillars between hosts and guests because it guarantees that we can enforce if needed.

What are the best options going forward ? We are thinking:

1)  Did anyone sue Airbnb ? Can you share your experience ?

2) The guest left a bad review. I think Airbnb should NOT allow people who entered into a bad dispute to leave a review. I did not leave a review. However, Airbnb has no clear guidelines about this.

3)  I unlisted the property and I have one property listed still with airbnb that I am planning to unlist as well. The price charged by Airbnb from hosts and guests are too much and airbnb expects somehow us to milk our prices. We are planning to move to another platform and we would appreciate recommendations specially knowing that Airbnb will not uphold the terms and conditions in a dispute review.

Thanks,

[Gerry-And-Rashid0]

Sounds like you were charging the cleaning fee in cash - outside of the booking system? Otherwise this is a bit bizzare - people can charge whatever they wish for their property. First time I have ever heard of anyone being refunded because AirBnB thought the price for accommodation or cleaning was a bit high. Is there more to this story?

[Lucas18]

@Gerry-And-Rashid0 The cleaning fee was set in the system and the Guest accepted. He tried to negotiate the fee after coming to the apartment with me which I did my best to and the owner accepted provided he fulfilled certain conditions. He did not honor any of those and we denied. After that, he escalated to Airbnb.

The conditions were really simple.  1) Leave the place clean; 2) Leave before a specific time frame because new guests were coming on the date of departure.  The Guest accepted and only then he booked. He not only returned the place filfhy, he left the place late. My other guests had to wait two hours because when we saw all the mess I had to hire people very quickly. The new guests were coming from MIA international. The guest was very selfish and unconsiderate. 

The worse part is that I had a friend to meet him late at night so that He and his girldfriend could be in the house and not sleep outside. I dont accept late check in mind you. After all, it is hard to manage if people come when they want.  In his review, he lied downright on every single item and he did a pretty good damage. With all the stains we found, we paid more than 150 USD to clean the property decently and had a 150 USD loss that the Geust accepted when he booked on Airbnb website which was overturned by Airbnb because Airbnb apprently can re- write the terms and conditions . 

[Mag0]

I have the same experience, doesn't matter what is agreed to by the guest when they check in. Airbnb will overturn any agreement the guest agreed to in their favour. I had a check out time at 9am, with late check out penalty of $40 is charged. Guests checked out at 10am, I requested the guest pay $40. Airbnb was contacted for mediation. They're response, well it's not that late and that's the final decision we will be 'disengaging' from this dispute.

I will be removing my listings fairly soon, this is the 3rd time this has happened. They are siding more with guests as it seems they need more guests to get on the platform than hosts.

[Brian68]

TBH a 9am check out it is a bit much!

[Mariam23]

I have been very unhappy with airbnb as a host. I had a dispute after a guest checked in. He was just point blank rude and crazy. Airbnb refunded him against my refund policy! And ever since then they have not released any of my payouts even though i always get a payout a day after a guest checks in. I am considering suing them. I propose that hosts who havr been wronged by airbnb come together and find a way to get our rights! 

[Clare0]

@Lucas18 I just read the guest's review.  Were any of the things he said true?  Sounds like his biggest complaint was that you charged a pretty high cleaning fee ($150) yet, according to this guest, the place was filthy.  If that was the case, I would agree that your price is too high if the place wasn't clean when he arrived.  Guests have a right to expect clean accommodations. 

In the listing you currently have, the cleaning fee ($101) is more than your nightly rate ($98). Also your security deposit is over $800!  This is pretty excessive in my view and I can't say that siding with the guest was inappropriate on Airbnb's part. 

[Lucas18]

@Clare0 None of the things he said is true. The place was not filfthy at all. I have the pictures. The cleaning fee is high 150 USD. We do that to show guests that if you want to stay you have to be sure.  Did you read the previous review ? you will see that th e other Guest left couple of days before. She left the place very clean. He just made up lies and it saddened  us to see how low he would go.

What really made us more sad was that Airbnb did not do a proper due deligence. The gist is this: You cannot accept the terms and conditions and then later force a reversal. This is what happened. You see, when the guest accept to take the place the price is disclosed  upfront if he or she finds it expensive then they are welcome to shop somewhere else.

The bottom line is that the owners decided not to list anymore with me. On Top, the place was returned filfthy. Did you read the response I return ? I am seriously thinking to press charges against Airbnb.

[Clare0]

@Lucas18 Please be sure to send me an update on how your lawsuit goes!

[Lucas18]

I can only do that with the owners consent. That's the reason I am asking the community experience. I frankly have no time unless it does worth. All I know is that I don't have anymore that listing.

[Cathy4]

I think there's an issue here about violation of airbnb terms. You are meant to agree that you will not

" offer, as a Host, any Accommodation that you do not yourself own or have permission to rent as a residential or other property (without limiting the foregoing, you will not list Accommodations as a Host if you are serving in the capacity of a rental agent or listing agent for a third party)" 

It seems you are an agent for a third party (you keep referring to 'the owners', and now they are 'not listing with' you any more. 'Nuff said?!  

[Amy38]

@Cathy4 

Oh my, this is interesting...I had no idea.  I have wondered about the "hosts" around me who have 40 properties!

That is the way abnb is going....lots fewer hosts to deal with and as pros, less trouble.

[Cormac0]

@Lucas

I a bit bamboozled as to why you charge such a high cleaning fee, if you expect your Guest to leave your accommodation in such a clean and tidy condition, you can't have it both ways.

I would wonder what exactly I paying the cleaning fee for?

With regards to Airbnb overruling your terms and conditions, two contract exist

1. A contract between Guest and Airbnb, Client
2. A contract Between Airbnb and Host, subcontractor

No contract exists between Guest and Host ergo Airbnb can change what they like!

Regards

Cormac

[Clare0]

@Cormac0 There might be a fine line distinction of definition for "contract" and "agreement" but in Airbnb's Terms of Service it describes that hosts and guests enter into an agreement when a guest is Pre-approved or a booking is accepted.  Here's the relevant text: 

"7.1.6 When you accept or have pre-approved a booking request by a Guest, you are entering into a legally binding agreement with the Guest and are required to provide your Host Service(s) to the Guest as described in your Listing when the booking request is made. You also agree to pay the applicable Host Fee and any applicable Taxes, which will be collected pursuant to the Payments Terms."

[Cormac0]

@Clare0

A contract is a written or verbal agreement that is enforceable by law. An agreement is the same, however it is typically not enforced by the law. A contract is a formal agreement which is legally binding, usually created for business purposes, or to ensure the safety of one's ASSETS.

A very wide distinction in my estimation, lawyers don't use words ambivalently.

I rest my case...

Regards

Cormac

The Explorer's Club Krakow III