Mass Shooting in Airbnb house in Orinda last night, 4 dead

[Lan1]

Breaking news:  4 dead, many injured in  an Airbnb party house in Orinda CA last night ( 10/31). The house is just few steps away from my second residence in the same street. About 10:00pm, My daughter and I were driving back to our residence, noticed that the street were full of cars. After a while, we heard police helicopters and ambulances arriving ....Neighboor next door told us there was a mass shooting in the Airbnb house few steps away.

The head of Airbnb trust and safety announced that  they will conduct serious investigation, according to the news.

My dear fellow host, I have been posting  many times regarding my concerns to Airbnb unsafe booking process.  My own house has been targeted several times for huge parties/criminal activities, but it couldn’t get enough attention from Airbnb trust and safety 

department.

 Please protect yourself and be safe!

[Linda108]

"Safety and security is more important than making money..." is right @Mike1034 however,  remote hosts without local contact, using IB, accept self-check in for one night from someone relatively local.  Then complain that Air BNB isn't doing their job. 

What about the host's job and good sense?   I think people are making the potential of income supercede smart, safe business.  Even @Lan1  who expressed concern about being "targeted" accepted a local with no reviews for a single night.  Why would a guest make a reservation for 4 when the house can accommodate 14, as in this case.  Fortunately, @Lan1  is not remote and handled the situation appropriately.  

Vetting is the host's job.  Contacting Air BNB is not the first step to remove guests who are actively breaking rules and causing concern for safety and security.  I've read posts from hosts that call Air BNB before calling the police when there is  an urgent safety issue.  

[Mark116]

@Linda108   Sure they do, that's because airbnb has taught them that they have to strike first, and get their side into the record, god forbid they wait until the cops arrive and by that time the guest has already created some fabrication and their airbnb will side with the guests, LOL.   I would never rent out my listing or any other listing for one night, especially not a 'mansion' but maybe some hosts have a different set of incentives, but that doesn't change the fact that airbnb actively makes it difficult for hosts to screen guests:  no real names needed, no photos, penalties for declining anyone, no security deposit, significant potential for negative consequences for use of cameras or for asking for IDs, and the list goes on. I wish that airbnb just acted as a booking site, instead of micro managing everything about the host's assets and then refusing to take responsibility when it goes wrong.

[Mike1034]

@Linda108  Indeed there are hosts who pay more attention to money than safety and security. But it does not void Airbnb's responsibilities for lessening security and safety screening, no enforcement of hosts' house rules with fines, and no real deposit from guests etc. The elimination of those system deficiency will help to prevent issues from the root.

[Yocencia0]

> When a host chooses two or three day minimum nights requirement, it blocks the possibility of party guests

It does NOT block the possibility of a party guest, it only makes it less likely.   If everyone in an areas has a 2 night minimum then it does nothing as the party guest will still book for two night and just leave early.

[Damon42]

You gotta keep those dangerous poor people from Oakland out. Am I right?

Comments like this is why AirBnB hides profile pics. Your comments allude to the fact that you would discriminate by location. Who knows what else.

I am all for host being safe, but discrimination is not okay.

[Jude9]

This hits home for me. Because the headline reads "The person who rented the Airbnb for the party told the host they needed the house for a relative who suffers from asthma to escape the fire in Northern California."
I am in Berkeley and had my cottage listed on Open Homes. Yesterday I got 2 inquiries from supposed fire refugees, both of which  felt "off." I'm not saying they would have killed anyone. But one had severe health issues and the other was not even listed as living in a fire zone. I ended up deleting my Open Homes status. I'm sad about that because in theory I support the concept. But it is naive to launch the program without basic protections--I couldn't see any of the usual information on these people claiming a need for free housing. That creates conditions ripe for scamming. And now Airbnb is getting some really bad PR as a result of failing to do so.

[Gregory87]

@Lan1 , @Branka-and-Silvia0, and others (not able to add everyone):

The account that I read in the Washington Post states, "The owner of the property, Michael Wang, told the Chronicle that he rented the home to a woman who claimed she was organizing a 12-person family reunion."  Also, this is not the first time he has had problems with his rental, "The property had been reported by neighbors for having large parties before but had not been on the city’s radar for months, officials said. City regulations on short-term rentals prohibit more than 13 people from occupying a property, City Manager Steve Salomon said. The owner had been cooperative with city officials after the reports of large gatherings — including one in February that resulted in a violation notice for the owner — and said he would comply with the regulations, Salomon said."

As other posters have mentioned, hosts need to take greater precautions when they don't live on site. This host is an example of this: "Property records list the owner of the 3,972-square-foot home as Michael Young Wang and show a 2005 purchase price of $1.25 million. Residents from four homes in the neighborhood said he never appeared to move in or live there. Records show that Wang’s primary residence is in Concord. At the Concord home Friday, a Subaru SUV sat in the driveway, and although someone could be seen moving behind the curtains of a window, no one answered the door."

Check out this flyer from social media advertising the party:

The flyer was adorned with crime-scene tape and told attendees to send a direct message to obtain the location and to “BYOB” and “BYOW” (Bring Your Own Weed).

Interestingly enough a local paper wrote on article titled Orinda shooting: What can Airbnb do about violence at its rentals?  (https://www.mercurynews.com/2019/11/01/orinda-shooting-what-can-airbnb-do-about-violence-at-its-rent...).  The article makes it sounds as though Airbnb's "hands are tied" with respect to curbing these incidents.  Do you agree?  I'm sure that many hosts have plenty of suggestions for possible solutions (and they've been expressed previously).  Anyone expect any changes as a result of this and other similar incidents?

[Branka-and-Silvia0]

@Gregory87 

tnx for sharing this link.

I cite "...Airbnb tells hosts they can set house rules, require guests to complete verifications like providing an ID, or ask for security deposits but Not all hosts do all of that." 

(Yeah, like it helps... house rules are hidden below the reviews,   ID is impossible to get from ABB in case of any problem with guests, and security deposit is not actually taken.)

Then in the next chapter :

"...there had been noise complaints about parties at the Lucille Way house in the past six months, even though the property listing called for no parties."

and

"... This particular listing asked for no weapons and no smoking or marijuana, and said “neighbors are close” so quiet hours were supposed to be between 10 p.m. and 8 a.m.,."

So, basically, Airbnb holds hosts responsible to protect their properties but at the same time weakens them as much as possible. But THE most unbelievable move is when ABB refunds the guest who was kicked out of property for breaking house rules/damage/party! I am surprised they don't get a medal too.

[Mark116]

@Branka-and-Silvia0   Do you have any doubt if this was just a party, and no one was shot, but cops were called and guests kicked out that airbnb would have refunded them in full?  

[Branka-and-Silvia0]

@Mark116  If these guests booked for more than 1 night and this incident occurred the first night of their stay, I wouldn't be surprised if they get refunded too.  Out of host's pocket of course..

[Lan1]

@Gregory87 Thank you for the detailed information and the Mercury news link. 

1: Regardless what happened, Airbnb has been one of the best platform for accommodations. Most of us, as hosts and guests has been enjoying great experiences in Airbnb. Ban Airbnb won’t  stop crimes.

2: Any system, in order to function well, always needs to be developed to a new level according the changes of the demanding. Now it is crucial for Airbnb to make security changes in booking process to protect hosts as well as our guests 

3: It IS AIRBNB RESPONSIBILITY to provide guests information to hosts: ID,  verified current address, legal name, group people detailed information, purposes of the trip etc. 

4: It is hosts responsibility to determine acceptance or reject the guest WITHOUT  PENALTY PRESSURE.  

5: after accepting the guests, it IS HOSTS RESPONSIBILITY to communicate with guests and have security systems to protect everyone in the property.

6: Airbnb always assures us that Safety is Priority to us, but in order to get more bookings, they gave up this basic principle.

My voice couldn’t get enough attention  from Airbnb, I hope this time, those gun shots could wake up Ben Breit or Brian Chesky....

[Jody79]

I completely agree with the points @Lan1 has made here.  Unfortunately I also live in an area where ABB parties are rampant and in our early days fell prey to.  The only reason we were able to contain them was because we live at the property.  We've since put measures in place to help prevent them (no one nighters, no locals, etc).  I agree that we as hosts need to do our best and put measures in place to prevent these occurrences, however ABB needs to do their part as well.  First and foremost require full identification for any guest (or host) upon registration.  Unfortunately reviews are meaningless when it comes to the guest that plans to throw a party.  All they need to do is cancel their account and open up a new one under a different name.  This exact scenario happened with us, after I gave an honest review of this individual, he simply canceled that account.

[Jude9]

@Gregory87  How bizarre that the Post would change the story. Here is a quote from San Francisco, with an AP source (and the same info appeared elsewhere):

"The four-bedroom home had been rented on Airbnb by a woman who told the owner her dozen family members had asthma and needed to escape smoke from a wildfire, the person with knowledge of the transaction told The Associated Press. A fire burning in Sonoma County about 60 miles (97 kilometers) north of Orinda earlier in the week fouled the air over a wide area."
Source: https://www.sfgate.com/business/technology/article/No-arrests-after-California-Halloween-shooting-14...

I tend to believe this reason. Airbnb was actively promoting Open Homes in the area at the time

[Gregory87]

@Jude9 :  I have no doubt that you've seen the reason in various periodicals and that it sounds plausible.  After perusing other media sources, I've seen both your version and mine.  Usually when "Open Homes" excuse was mentioned, the source indicated was the police, a source with knowledge of the situation or both.

I found the following statement from the host/owner of listing in the SF Chronicle (which was the original source for the Washington Post) and he is quoted as follows:  "The party’s host rented the house through Airbnb and claimed she was holding a family reunion for 12 people, said Michael Wang, who purchased the home around two years ago. Wang, 58, said the woman who rented the home said she was from Lafayette and planned to have a family reunion at the property after “going through issues.”"

Coverage appears to be similar to a game of Telephone.  The information starts out one way and as it passes from one media representative to another and the message gets distorted.  Ultimately, it doesn't matter how the guest deceived the host...the unfortunate outcome is the same. 😞

The host also made mention of the difficulty in screening guests and avoiding the illegal booking for parties because of the lack of cooperation/policies of Airbnb.  

Wang, the owner, said he was frustrated with Airbnb.

“We don’t want local people to have a party there,” he said. “We can’t control it. Airbnb does not release the customer information before they really book, so we have no way to know. We also tell them there’s a maximum (number of) people and no parties, but people lie.”

I read the statements from Brian Chesky, Airbnb CEO, and most of the new procedures are reactive (post incidents); when will there be proactive steps be taken?

SOURCE:  SF Chronicle (https://www.sfchronicle.com/crime/article/4-people-killed-at-Orinda-house-party-reports-say-14767586...)

[Greg6]

I have decided to de-list our apartment, out of respect for the community-at-large, and will work to encourage others here in Orinda to do the same. The hope will be for meaningful control for we hosts, and regulations for the community to fall back on. 

While we are small-time, compared to these big houses, and our guests have been amazing these past five years, I feel it's the right thing to do. 

Anyone with me?