My neighbor is asking for information about my guests?

Deborah0
Level 10
California, United States

My neighbor is asking for information about my guests?

A host shared this a while back, and I thought it would make a good subject for discussion.  

 

A host, call her Elaine, said that she had a difficult neighbor , call her Rebecca, who gets upset when anyone parks  in front of her house.  Elaine has duly asked her guests to please NOT park in front of Rebecca's house, and has even written that into her house rules.  She says that most all her guests comply.  She also says that all her guests have been quiet and polite ---really no problems.    Then, Elaine had a guest who smoked  cigarettes outside of the unit (since smoking is prohibited inside), after which she received an email from Rebecca, asking that Elaine please have the people smoke INSIDE her house,  because the smoke was wafting into Rebecca's  house with her apparently asthmatic kids and it was too hot for her to close the windows. Elaine then went and  asked her guests to please try not to smoke anywhere near Rebecca's house outside, apologized and gave REbecca  a  bouquet of flowers for the trouble.

 

Then, a couple weeks later,  a guest parked in front of REbecca's house. Her husband wrote Elaine  a note asking for the names, age, race, number of guests, arrival & departure times, model and makes of the their cars for all guests. Elaine said that she found this outrageous, and wondered how others have dealt with touchy neighbors particularly in the context of all the news in the papers about cities cracking down on Airbnb and nightmare guest stories. Then Elaine asked for suggestions on how to respond.  

 

What would YOU advise that Elaine do?  

 

When enough people respond, I will write more about what happened next in this real life situation.  

17 Replies 17
Maria-Lurdes0
Level 10
Union City, NJ

 I would not comply with the neighbors request for information, but I would be very careful to accompany any future parking-required guests to a suitable parking location and to very clearly tell them/show them that they must not park in front of the neighbors house.   Then I would tell the neighbor that she is free to have any car parked in her driveway towed, as you've made it clear to the guests that they must not park there or they will be towed.

 

  Sorry, I just re-read it.   Is the issue parking in front of her house because she owns the right-of-way or parking in front of her house because she wants to keep the public space available for her own car?

Deborah0
Level 10
California, United States

Hi Maria!

The issue is that the neighbor Rebecca feels possessive about the street space in front of her own house.  She does not own that right of way, and also, she does not actually ever park her own car in that spot, nor does her husband park in that spot, as they have a two car driveway and park both their vehicles in their own driveway.  However, she will at times have a guest or friend coming over and wants her own friend to be able to park in front of her own house.  Even if she isn't due to have a friend coming over, she still wants that space in front of her house not used by Elaines' guests.  

Rebecca has the right to have the parking in front of her house available for guests. If Elaine is going to have Airbnb guests that have way too many cars then she needs to work with some other spots or clearly list that in her Airbnb listing that only certain amount of spots are available. I am not Rebecca but I have issues with my neighbors gues parking too close to may driveway which makes getting in and out of my property a hassle. In this case I side with Rebecca. I would not even bother with getting the names but have now starting calling the towing company. And the cops are happy to give those cars parking violations as well.

Queenie0
Level 10
United States

I require guests to park either in my driveway or directly in front of my house. Right or wrong, neighbors can get territorial about their outdoor space, including on-street parking. I think it's an easy concession to make for the sake of peace in the neighborhood.

Judalon0
Level 10
Los Angeles, CA

This host has been very nice in her handling of a clearly nutty-neighbor. I too do my best to keep neighbors happy, but I also do not tell them I do Airbnb. I grew up in Asia, lived all over the world and I just say I have a lot of visiting family, friends, and friends of friends. I do provide off-street parking, but my driveway is hard to navigate so most guests opt for street parking. No one owns the street parking in front of their home and they have no legal grounds to do anything to the host, but unhappy neighbors is never good for anyone. Again, if the neighbor can not be pleased no matter what the host does then there is little point in making any effort to please her.

 

I would invest in having a lawyer write a letter stating that she has no legal claim on the parking in front of her home, and I'd have him go down the list of her complaints showing she has no legal recourse and that smoking on one's property is legal and they are not responsible for the way the wind blows. I'd have him state in the letter how his client has and will continue to minimize these problems because they wish to keep a harmonious environment in the neighborhood, but ask that the neighbor be reasonable otherwise it looks like the neighbor has some grudge or just wants to harass the host and a restraining order might be required.

 

The neighbor sounds like she has emotional or mental problems and needs someone to vent her anger/frustrations on. 

 

I absolutely would not violate the privacy of my guests by giving her any information on them other than to say, "nice couple" "lovely family" "delightful young man here to do short internship" "sweet girl here with her mother to check out UCLA" ... just generic, positive statements with no details. Now, let's talk about the neighbors Uncle who could be fresh out of jail and come to stay with the neighbor, or her brother who might be a sex offender... let's talk about the detailed background of the people who come to visit her home, any of them could be thieves, drug abusers, drunks, pedophiles... neighbor won't like having that magnifying glass turned on her and her associates.

Granted that nobody owns the parking space in front of their home, I disagree about having a lawyer write a letter. You don't want to inflame the situation with the neighbor, especially with the current situation in Los Angeles where the city council is in the process of deciding whether to allow Airbnb, it is better not to give the neighbors reasons to became anti-Airbnb activists. I would attempt to co-operate with the neighbor, yet give no information whatever about the guests. Be vigilant. If you notice the guests parking in front of her house, ask them to move their car. Make it clear when they check in that parking in front of her house is verboten. If she complains, simply apologize and promise to be more mindful. As an Airbnb host, you don't want to make enemies of your neighbors, no matter how ridiculous they may be.

Deborah0
Level 10
California, United States

Okay, so now I will share about what happened in the real-life situation where this occurred:

 

Elaine wrote a polite email to Rebecca, stating she had asked the guests to move the car (which they already had done). Elaine then  brought over a baked dessert to Rebecca as a gift.     Rebecca still insisted on knowing when new guests would be arriving and departing, saying "If you (eg Elaine) will be running a short-term rental in what is a residential neighborhood."   Rebecca felt this was quite fair for them to know all this, even though Elaine welcomed Rebecca to contact her in any way ( text, cell phone or email) if Rebecca had any parking issue.  So Elaine did everything she reasonably could be expected to do, to appease her neighbors, and yet they continued to undreasonably demand information from her about her guests:  something which I consider a form  of bullying.  Elaine remained polite but firm, refusing to provide them any info, but also avoiding being drawn into an escalation of the situation.  

 

By the way, I would like to point out that in the particular city where Elaine and Rebecca live, that city is in the process of developing short term rental regulations (which have not yet been completed), so one issue for Elaine is that short term rentals are not currently "legal" in her city.  However, her city intends to legalize them.  In evaluating how to regulate short term rentals, the city has stated that short term rentals at a residential dwelling are NOT a commerical use of that property, and in fact the planning commission in that city wrote that "Short term rental use is an accessory use to residential use."  Accessory use is defined as "A use that is of the same nature as or complementary to the principal use of a lot or building located on the same lot, that is not independent of the principal use."  Another city wrote in its zoning code, "short term rentals are an incidental use to a residential use..."  

 

A Colorado court also affirmed that short term rentals in a private home are not a commerical use of that property:  https://community.airbnb.com/t5/Responsible-Hosting/Colorado-Court-says-short-term-rentals-are-not-c...

 

All this info can help hosts with neighbors who are claiming that Airbnb hosting is a commerical activity in a residential area.  This is not the case in these statements above.  

I think this host deserves praise for such level-headed handling of the situation. I guess I'm getting too old for such patience and molly-coddling of such blatant bullying, controlling, and aggressive behavior by a neighbor who has no more rights to the public parking on the street in front of her house than anyone else, or to know anything about the hosts guests any more than anyone has the right to know the details of who visits the neighbors home. 

 

I gather that the neighbor continues to insert herself into the hosts business, and that the host continues to bite her lip, bake deserts and puts up with it. I am not suggesting this for others, but I'd rather get a lawyer and go after her, have an unpleasant 6-12 months then be done with it. Bullies never stop bullying until the little guy punches them and knocks them down... sad, but unfortunately true. I used to be the doormat trying to keep peace, and now in my 60's I see what a waste it was and how unhealthy is was for me emotionally. Now I take a position and I fight for it and the bullies leave me alone as soon as they see I'm a fighter not a placator. 

 

Finally, I suppose it will help for government to define and make laws for short-term rentals, but again, this is not new and has been going on since Mary and Joseph, it's just now we have media to focus on it and make people more conscious of what is going on. I feel that the more our government adds rules, laws and regulations the further we get away from the core, the heart and the foundation of this country which is liberty and freedom. I grew up in Asia and honestly, felt much freer and less intruded upon by government there than here. This is not the land of the free it is the land of regulations.

 

@Deborah0thanks for posting this and giving us the follow-up. It's good to have input on various ways to approach the problems hosts face.

Deborah0
Level 10
California, United States

Yes, @Judalon0, these situations with neighbors or really anyone who "gets into your business" can be very trying.  And I agree, what the neighbors in this case were doing is a form of bullying.   It is very tempting to push back against bullies, but all too often, the reason the bully can do the bullying, is that there is some vulnerable situation that someone is in, which the bully tries to exploit -- for instance, being an Airbnb host in a city which has not yet created modern-day short term rental regulations -- meaning that the legality of such is still in a "grey" area, a legal limbo.

 

  So the whole context needs to be considered.  I am very definitely with you in generally advising people not to be doormats in their lives, in any department in their lives.  I  think that to simply be aware that one is being bullied, and drawing lines to prevent or circumscribe that, indicate that one is not taking a "doormat" role.   I dont' think one necessarily has to push back, in order not to be a doormat.  Sometimes the context of the situation makes it difficult, or perhaps unwise, to do more than assert boundaries and refuse to be bossed around -- a pushback may lead to more problems.  Situations can easily be escalated by those who have the motivation to do so, and I at least am not up for wars with my neighbors.  Some people I know have "gotten into it" with a neighbor on some issue,  only to come out the next day and find their car vandalized, or trash dumped in their yard, or dog poop put in their mailbox -- and more.   People can be nasty so it always pays to know what kind of person you are dealing with.   Yes, you can push back -- but I think it always needs to be asked, at what cost?  IT's good to first assess what the person you are dealing with is capable of.  For once a "feud" begins between the Hatfields and the McCoys, it could go on for more than 6 months, it could be a lifetime feud!  So my advice is to simply hold one's boundaries and be assertive without being aggressive, and avoid escalating a difficult situation.  

Hats off to you for this comment. This is exactly what my neighbor does to me and you used the perfect words. Yes, I definitely need to get a lawyer. It has been emotionally draining me and physically I feel like crap. She bullies me all the time. Talks to my guests. Click their pictures. It is horrendous.

9/13 water coming from a b b above me.  Early 9/14 informed owner.  Late 9/14 water still coming.  Went to condo spoke to guest asked her if owner informed her, she said no.  Why did this a b b host not make other accommodations for his quest?  Why did I have to get more water damage?

I would never, ever give anyone any information on my guests. It is a private matter between you and your guest.

Is it even legal to collect and hand over information, especially identifying information such as name, age, and race? what's that about?

 

I would say sorry I cannot give you personal (or any) information.

This is half-joking, but why doesn't Elaine give her neighbour the wrong information about who is staying? I'd advise guests about the difficult neighbour -- especially the parking situation -- but then I would also ask them, as politely as possible, to not engage the neighbour in any conversation as she has emotional problems and has been known to be clingy, i.e., "Just a polite nod would be advised since she may try to engage you in an extended conversation and you may have a difficult time getting away."  (Tee hee hee!)

 

That way, the people who are parking there could be anyone, or visiting someone at Elaine's house. The thing is to make sure to keep the spot as free as possible, but give Ms. Nutty Neighbour enough information to keep her happy. 

 

Okay, okay, I know it's not honest, but I just had to throw this suggestion in here. 🙂 Sometimes obfuscation--making things as murky as possible--is one option, although, of course, who wants to act like a politician 🙂

It is funny I found this article because of searching for what if anything can be done about a neighbor who leaves her house for months at a time and rents the entire house to people through Air BNB.
Well, the neighbor (I will call Jan) has gone to Europe for six months and rented her house to six women all of which have a car. First of all, where I live, it is illegal to rent a house to more than three people if they are not related. Yes, I think it is a dumb law, but it is a law all the same. The way I know about this law is because I own rental property and have to keep up with all the laws that apply to landlords. These women are not related because a company rented the house for them to live in for a six-month training seminar.
Jan as I typed earlier has gone to Europe for six months, and her tenants/guests park in front of my house regularly, and I never have anywhere to park except across the street. I own a vacant lot between Jan's house and my house, so I have a good size lot due to combining the two lots into one. Therefore, I own more land than anyone in the neighborhood and their's a park across the street so some of her tenants/guests could park across the street. However, they park their cars for days and take uber to most places.
Realizing I do not own the street, and I ordinarily wouldn't be concerned but my partner is over 70 years old, and I do not like him crossing the street due to having problems with his eyes. He has almost stepped out in front of traffic twice, and it scares me, but the tenants/guests do not seem to be at all concerned.
I am in a quandary at what to do because I do not want to seem like a petty person, but sometimes I have groceries, etc. to unload, and I am never able to park in front of my house. I either have to cross the very busy street we live on or park in another block and walk. IT get's quite hectic when you are trying to carry a trunk load of groceries over a block.
Can anyone give me any ideas about what you might do if Jan lived next door to you?
OBTW, Jan stays gone ten months out of the year for her job, and it is the reason she rents her entire house.