Where is the sense!

[Robin4]

The Community Centre is just the tip of the hosting iceberg, less than 5% of Airbnb users are active in the various language forms of the CC.

Just on the English CC board we are aware that Airbnb in the past week has blocked the booking calendars of the following fine hosts.

Lisa 723……………………Superhost…….365 reviews

Alon1.............................Superhost……..377 reviews

Belinda55………………...Superhost…….328 reviews

Ria16………………………...Superhost…….285 reviews

Emily1……………………....Superhost……..196 reviews

Emma2259……………...Superhost……..155 reviews

Nathalie-et- Gilles0...Superhost.…….143 reviews

Aidan65…………………...Superhost……..125 reviews

Ricardo85………………..Superhost ……..83 reviews

Deborah56……………...Superhost……….92 reviews

Clare167……………….....Superhost…….…58 reviews

Vangie9…………………...Superhost……….68 reviews

Debra300…………….....Superhost………..51 reviews

What was their sin, they refused to agree and sign up to Airbnb's  ECP with regard to COVID-19 because, they felt the terms of the ECP were unachievable and unenforceable! These are hosts with integrity, the backbone of Airbnb! They could have simply agreed and kept on doing whatever they do. But they didn't, they took a stand against a completely ridiculous policy and their future reservations have now been compromised. The whole thing is obviously a sham because all they need to do to open their booking calendars again is, sign an agreement to the ECP terms.

But the worst part of this whole affair is, one arm of the company do not know what another arm is doing! Hosts are being compelled to make decisions on conflicting information! A request for clarification of the ECP by @Lisa723  got this response from the head of Global Hosting  @Catherine-Powell ......

This response, although written back in November 2020 clearly states that everything that is made available to a guest must be washed and sanitised between guests. This is obviously a big ask, to wash and sanitize the entire property between bookings. This is exactly why many hosts chose not to tick the ECP requirement box, it is simply too big  a task, but the head of global hosting has said.....that is what is required!

But low and behold another version of the ECP has popped up, once again thanks to the great work by @Lisa723

This has gone too far, Those great hosts I have mentioned above who probably represent less than .001% of the company's total hosts have been screwed because of conflicting information. 

All we ask is for the company to be fair, we just want competent personnel to fill decision making positions. It doesn't matter a dime to them.....but it's our livelihood.

Cheers.........Rob 

[Clare167]

Thanks for the kind mention, @Robin4 , and it will be interesting to see how @Catherine-Powell responds.

[Mike-And-Jane0]

@Clare167 The chance of @Catherine-Powell responding to a negative post is somewhere between nil and zero. Shame really and I hope I am wrong.

[Ricardo85]

@Robin4 

This situation of the blocked calendar is getting more and more surreal ...

See what Airbnb sent me, even with my calendar suspended.

https://www.airbnb.com.br/highlights/3719145?s=67&unique_share_id=73a736f6-cfd0-49da-a0d7-0221988540...

[Mark116]

@Robin4  "Lauren's" response is a little weird, no?  What exactly does she mean by 'left out' but not the entire home?  Confusing.  Same with the wording about linens, now it is only a 'best practice' to wash linens when they're dirty?  Huh?  WTF?  

You can always count on Airbnb to have more than one answer to the same question, though, at least they are consistent in this. 

[Robin4]

@Mark116 

Ok, lets look at the official Airbnb 5 step Covid cleaning guide!

Step 1: Prepare

Proper preparation can help you and your team clean more efficiently and more safely. Make sure to:

• Ventilate the space before and during cleaning, when possible
• Use disinfectants approved by your local regulatory agencies for use against COVID-19
• Always read the directions and warnings on your cleaning products carefully
• Wash or disinfect your hands and wear a mask and gloves while cleaning

Now there is nothing out of the ordinary there except for the wearing of gloves and a mask. I don't mind the disposable gloves bit, I am more than happy to do that. I have however had my Covid 19 vaccination and I do host in a Covid free state. Masks are not suggested or recommended here, so I would only wear one if a guest requested I should.

Step 2: Clean

Cleaning is when you remove dust and dirt from surfaces, such as floors and benchtops. Make sure to:

• Sweep, vacuum, dust and/or mop areas before sanitising
• Wash all dishes and laundry at the highest heat setting possible
• Wipe down hard surfaces with soap and water

This is where the ambiguous bit comes in. 'Wash all dishes and laundry at the highest heat setting possible'  What does 'all' dishes and laundry mean? I have taken it to mean what @Lauren2775 the head of covid cleaning's  interpretation. I sought the Airbnb cleaning handbook for the correct information but, once again it is ambiguous

https://www.airbnb.com.au/cleaning/handbook

It just says change gloves before handling clean linens. And on the dishes, it does tend to infer dishes and utensils that the guest has handled. But you can see how Step 2 is open to interpretation.

Step 3: Sanitise

Sanitising is when you use chemicals to reduce the number of bacteria on surfaces such as doorknobs and TV remotes. Make sure to:

• Spray high-touch surfaces in each room with an approved disinfectant spray
• Let the disinfectant stand for the length of time specified on the product label
• Allow the surface to air dry

I have always done that, it's what I do in our house and I would not abandon doing it for my guests. That I would have thought is just a regular part of cleaning!

Step 4: Check


To access custom cleaning checklists, go to Performance > Cleaning. Make sure to:

• Refer to the best practices in each room-by-room checklist to make sure that all areas are cleaned and sanitised between each stay
• Share these requirements with your hosting team and cleaning professionals

Step 4 is simply telling us to check what we have already done. Once again, I always do that. Ever since I have been hosting I use a check-list  for every cottage service. I started doing it because I found sometimes I was overlooking things during the turn-around which the guest would pick up!

A copy of the completed checklist goes inside the house folder for each guest....

Step 5: Reset

To help prevent cross-contamination, it's important to finish cleaning and sanitising a room before replacing items for the next guest. Make sure to:

• Wash your hands and replace gloves before replacing guest supplies, linen and cleaning kits
• Safely dispose of or wash cleaning supplies and protective gear
• Don’t re-enter a room once it’s been sanitised
• Empty and/or clean your equipment (e.g. vacuum cleaner, microfibre cloths) between each turnover

My only concession to step 5 is I now wear gloves. Obviously my vacuum gets cleaned between guests, new sponges and disposable cleaning cloths are used every time.

These 5 steps should not be seen as arduous provided they are not taken absolutely literally! I am quite sure the bit about the laundry did not mean every article in the linen cupboard, it didn't mean every pot, dish and cup in the kitchen! It is telling us to clean thoroughly, and sanitise what ever a guest has come into physical contact with.

Mark I don't have an issue with what has to be done. My issue is that the company needs to get their message straight and not have us running around in circles!

Cheers........Rob

[Sarah977]

@Robin4 "Sanitising is when you use chemicals to reduce the number of bacteria on surfaces such as doorknobs and TV remotes."

That is actually incorrect. Soap and water kill bacteria and render viruses inactive. It isn't neccesary to use "chemicals" to sanitize. I have always used bleach wipes to sanitize, simply because it's faster and easier than washing everything down with soap and rinsing the soap off, but soap would disinfect just as well.

As far as the gloves go, that's just theatre. You could cough or sneeze into your gloved hand just as easily as into your bare hand. Gloves don't accomplish anything as far as preparing the space as long as your hands are freshly washed. It's just more PPE garbage.

Where gloves actually make sense is when handling guest's dirty laundry, not your clean laundry.

[Robin4]

@Sarah977 

I don't know if this product is universal but it has been available in Australia for 20 years and has been the leading disinfectant over that time.

It is claimed to get rid of anything other than Godzilla and reviews well......

Since COVID-19 has come along there has been a massive increase in the number of sanitising products on the market which have helped with laundry washing and other sanitising tasks. But I take your point Sarah, most of them are probably unnecessary and maybe do no more good than plain old fashion soap and water.

But once again, it is perception, it must be seen to be clean, and smell clean,  and because it has been around so long everyone here links the smell of Glen 20 with a well disinfected and clean space.

Another point the Airbnb cleaning section should possibly take on board......

 Why is Disinfecting important?

Remember that you should disinfect – not sanitize – because disinfectants are the only products approved by the EPA to kill viruses on hard surfaces.2 The main difference is that EPA-approved sanitizers only have claims for bacteria, while disinfectants have claims against both bacteria and viruses.

So Sarah, there you go maybe Airbnb are once again not just leading their guests 'up the garden path!'

Cheers...........Rob

[Ann72]

@Robin4  Thank you for posting both Catherine's response and Lauren's.  I knew Catherine's was wrong, all due respect to her.

When this was introduced, I read every word of the handbook (https://www.airbnb.com/cleaning/handbook), and it was clear to me we were already following these steps.  That's why it was easy for me to agree.

The major contradiction, to me, is in Step 4 above.  The first bullet point refers to "best practices" and the second to "requirements."  "Best practices" are not "requirements."  You can't call them one thing and then say they're another.  Sloppy.

[Lisa723]

@Robin4 @Ann72 

Last time I downloaded the handbook it said:

"It’s important to wash all the dishes –
even ones in the cabinet – to help ensure
hygienic standards. Start by walking
through the space and collecting dishes
from every room, to help avoid
cross-contamination."

I still have this copy, updated 6/15/2020. Looks like the phrase in bold was subsequently removed without any notice.

[Colleen253]

@Lisa723  "Looks like the phrase in bold was subsequently removed without any notice."

Little wonder there is so much confusion. 'Removed/changed without notice'. This type of thing happens a fair bit.

[Robin4]

@Lisa723 

That's a very interesting observation Lisa! Could you post a screenshot of that because it does rather vindicate what @Catherine-Powell said in writing to you back in November.

There is absolutely no mention of the "Even ones in the cupboard' in the current definition, and the current definition is the one I signed up to after discussions with CX.

It would be really handy to know just when this 'alteration' crept into the ECP!

I am not on a witch hunt here, I just want to the company to treat their hosts fairly.

If what you are stating Lisa is correct, and Airbnb have without notice made alterations to the ECP definitions between the time that hosts were notified they had to agree to it and now, then Airbnb has an obligation to immediately open up those hosts booking calendars they have blocked. They have failed to notify their hosts of the change and are currently penalising them for an interpretation that does not now exist.

That's like a cop saying to a motorist, "I am writing you a speeding ticket because the speed limit on this road used to be 50 MPH" .......!!!!

You just can't do that , come on Airbnb, be fair!

Cheers........Rob 

@Alon1  @Sarah977  @Colleen253  @Anonymous  @Belinda55  @Ann72 

[Lisa723]

@Robin4 

[Robin4]

@Lisa723 

Thanks Lisa, that tells us what we needed to know, the ball is in Airbnb's court now.

@Catherine-Powell , I am sorry I questioned the reliability of what you stated last November, but you can see how this has come about. Many hosts assessed the ECP as released last year to be unworkable, something that was impossible to achieve. The disinfecting of the entire property between guests was not a viable option. Many hosts do not have the laundering facilities to wash their entire inventory between guest stays, nor their food handling supplies and equipment. This is why they did not agree to the ECP.

But your ECP has changed since then, and the very part of it that prompted those host refusals to agree to, has been deleted, and yet you are still penalising those hosts by blocking their booking calendars.

At this point all hosts calendars should be opened again and hosts should at least be given the opportunity to agree or refuse to abide by your current ECP definitions. 

If they still refuse to accept the current definitions then you would be free to take whatever action you desired, as long as that action was spelt out to hosts.

Catherine as our hosting representative to the company I would ask you to address this issue urgently, your best hosts are being penalised for your oversight, not theirs!

And one other thing, can you please ask the team concerned to correctly describe what is required of hosts.  Your American EPA says quite conclusively that 'disinfecting' is the correct terminology not 'sanitizing'. The reason I bring this up, if an outbreak does get traced back to an Airbnb listing, the host would have the law on his side by stating "Airbnb told me to Sanitize, not disinfect"!  Try to get the terminology correct, hey.

https://www.epa.gov/coronavirus/whats-difference-between-products-disinfect-sanitize-and-clean-surfa...

Cheers.........Rob  

[Catherine-Powell]

@Robin4 @Lisa723

Hi Rob, Lisa, and others in the thread;

Thank you for sharing your thoughts and frustrations on the cleaning process. I can see that the lack of clarity has caused a great deal of confusion during what has been a difficult time for the Host community. We worked closely with health experts at the height of the pandemic to create our cleaning guidelines almost a year ago. The requirements were very strict because we were still learning about the virus. 

We’ve learned more about COVID-19 and the ways it can spread, and we’ve adjusted our cleaning guidelines to reflect this new info—but we didn’t clearly communicate those changes to our community. Thank you for providing feedback so we can improve the way we communicate in the future, especially around ever-evolving products and programs. 

When you attest to the enhanced cleaning process, you’re required to wash all dishes and linens that your guests have used during their stay. But you don’t need to wash any dishes or  linens in your space that a guest has not accessed or used during their stay.  When in doubt, we strongly suggest you err on the side of caution when it comes to cleaning items that guests may have touched or used.

We know this process may add time to your cleaning routine. But by committing to follow the five-step enhanced cleaning process between each stay, you’re taking important steps toward protecting yourself, your guests, and the entire Airbnb community. 

I hope this helps and provides clarity and reassurance to those Hosts who want to attest.

Separately, I am working with the team for a more comprehensive update to address the points raised by Hosts. 

Best to you all,

Catherine.