Is this a scam? Advice wanted

[Risa793]

I found a long-term rental contract in the UK from Facebook marketplace that allows pets, amazing location, pretty good deal. I checked their Facebook profile and she seems like a real person, a German 60ish woman (if it's fake, it's pretty well made). I contact her, she sends me a well-organised detailed email about the property, says bills are all included etc., I'm "not the only person interested in the flat" pets are okay, etc. She explains "I bought this apartment because I worked there but now I have moved permanently, I wanted to sell it initially but I decided that it is better to rent it. The apartment was rented for a short-term for several different people, but together with my family I decided to rent it only for a long-term from now on." (I didn't ask, but I thought ok cool.) Strangely she uses an encrypted email service (Proton Mail). I ask for a viewing and she says this: 

" I moved permanently from the country so I will not be able to come personally to take care of this rental.

We wanted to rent out the apartment the normal way, but we were very disappointed by two different persons that were not serious at all and wasted time, money for plane tickets and spent time in quarantine on the way back to home for nothing

Now I have a contract made with AIRBNB to of the appointments for visits. The meeting will take place in the apartment with an AIRBNB agent who will be appointed after you book the apartment and he will give you the keys, of course if you like it and you decide to rent it. The lease will be handed over by the AIRBNB agent but will be concluded between the two of us. A copy will remain with you and one will be sent to me by agent. I've invested a lot in this apartment and I'm sure you'll love it."

I didn't think this was too strange but I realised that Airbnb doesn't have this kind of service. So it must be a third party? I replied saying I was interested in a viewing, she asked me for all my personal details and passport ID. Excerpt of email: 

"We use AIRBNB only for booking, so we are both protected in this process. The payment of the monthly rent, of course, if you decide to rent my apartment, will be made directly into my bank account on a date that we will set together, of course when it will be good for you. 

...

As I told you I have a contract with Airbnb and they will help us for booking, viewing and possibly a rental. To establish a viewing it is necessary to complete the reservation on your behalf. After I receive this information, I will send it to the agent. After that we are waiting for the agent's confirmation that the apartment is booked and I will put you in touch with him to give you the latest details. Without this reservation Airbnb will not select any agent to present your apartment. All expenses with Airbnb will be borne by me regardless of your decision."

I send her my personal details. She replies saying "I sent them to the agent. Everything is ok. Please contact him at: email with this 10 digit code. I hope you can get a visit as soon as possible. The apartment is reserved in your name at this time." 

Initially I thought, ok she needs to use an agent if she's not in the country. But after her whole explanation using "Airbnb", strange email domain of the supposed agent (@airbnbagent.com), her email uses protonmail, it started to feel a bit fishy. The deal is pretty good, a little over our budget but it seemed worth it, it's a very new apartment with nice official photos. Usually when I mention I have a cat, they say something about furniture damage, but she didn't mention that at all. The use of Airbnb is a lie, because I don't think airbnb offers that service (it would have been more believable if she just said third party...)

If she said that we needed to pay before seeing the flat, that would confirm a scam. But she is providing the agent so we could view the flat before confirming. We might email the agent to see what happens, we are definitely not paying anything before we see the flat in person. But we are not sure.

Do you think it is a scam? 

[Ann72]

@Risa793  It’s not out of the question to find a legit rental on FB marketplace, but anything claiming to be Airbnb and operating in the way you describe is not legit.  That’s why the experienced hosts above, @Mark116 @Sarah977 and @Anonymous have told you in no uncertain terms that you’re dealing with a scammer.

Just because you can’t imagine how it could be a scam doesn’t mean it’s not.  Perhaps she will get someone to show you the place, you will take it and sign a “lease” and give her a deposit (though you will never have met her, only her “agent”), and then you’ll never hear from her again.  Perhaps no money will change hands but she’ll get your bank account details for the “security deposit.”  I don’t know and you don’t know but it is absolutely a scam.  One scamming method is to lull the victim step by tiny step.  You’ve proved you’re already being lulled by claiming this is “different.”  Good luck finding a nice rental for your needs.

[Risa793]

Yeah that could happen, thanks! 

I wanted to know how scammers do these things hence the question, I'm no longer  interested in the property (not worth risking, and if the landlord isn't here to help with anything while we live there it'll cause too many problems anyway). For example, I would like to know what would happen if I request a video call with her and show me her passport copy :)) will she have gotten that ready or will she stop emailing me haha. Anyway thanks for all your insights everyone, I'll update the email exchange 

[Risa793]

For those interested, I have an update:

I questioned her about the Airbnb agent asking more information about their actual business name etc., and she replied with a very lengthy, waffly message repeating what the agent supposedly does, how it's Airbnb ("I chose them because they are the biggest rental company in the world") and how "everything is fine". I said ok sounds good, can you send me a copy of your ID or passport photo just for peace of mind. And she suddenly became very defensive, this was her message: 

"It is clear that you have nothing to do with this rental. I feel like I did something wrong to you. Please let me know that I have a lot of work and I have 3 children, I can't take care of you. It is clear that you have a lot of free time and you have no interest in the apartment. That's why Airbnb has these policies. If you were going to rent, you definitely needed a male agent."

LOL, not sure what she means by male agent. I replied again because I was curious what she would say (and honestly it's quite funny to waste her time) but she is ignoring me so, that is the end of this thread. Anyway, thanks all for your replies. We have found a very nice place today through a legitimate service so we're happy. I would post her name on here (and her very well curated Facebook profile) in case someone else in unfortunate enough to have to deal with her but she has my contact details now and I'm scared she'll come for me lol. 

[Sarah977 · Accepted solution]

@Risa793  She won't "come for you", but it's not really important to mention these scammer's names, because those aren't their real names, it's all a scam and they change the names as they get found out. 

The "male agent" part is super weird. I think that was in reference to "I have 3  children, I can't take care of you". Like a male agent has no children to look after. 

Meantime, the scammer is probably some guy sitting in his mother's basement in Argentina, or Russia, or who knows where, whose mom is under the impression he's taking online courses all day.  🙂

[Anonymous]

@Risa793  Thanks for the follow-up; it's always amusing to hear what weird stuff scammers say when they're cornered.

But OK, in reality this is probably not actually a sexagenarian German woman - that's exactly the kind of fake identity a young dude in Lagos would create for a scam slightly more advanced than "HELP I'M A NIGERIAN PRINCE AND I JUST NEED YOUR ADVANCE FEE"

[Risa793]

@Anonymous @Sarah977 

Yeah true, they probably have multiple fake accounts like this too. But it's quite impressive how "real" they made it, she has profile pics dating back 2018 (even has a comment on one) and has been re-posting random posts on her feed every few months or so which gets at least 2 likes. So weird to think that these 'friends' are probably from the same organisation and help each other make convincing Facebook profiles. Another funny thing is how she has "3 children" she needs to take care of because she is definitely over 65 years old in her profile pic lol

[Amal551]

I wish I could send this post to everyone who has tried to rent through Facebook marketplace to warn them! Not enough people know about this scam.. i'm sure they've gotten a ton of people as its a super elaborate scam. The only reason I figured out it was a scam and found your post is because i inquired to two Facebook listings at the same time, and they both sent me emails with similar red flags. If I had only inquired to one listing I probably would have been scammed.
What made them seem legitimate:

-the Facebook account that posted the listing was made in 2018/2018

-- (normally when I see an apparent scam, I know its an apartment scam because the pics are too good to be true for the price, and the Facebook account that posted it was created in 2022)

-the email that contacted me about the apartment after I provided the original poster with my email address was an outlook domain email. I know that outlook is a paid domain so that added some legitimacy to me.

-one of the scammers told me that the agent who would meet me was a trip advisor agent and the other told me about an air B and B agent that would be showing me the apartment. I assumed that trivadvisorand airbnb offered this service but that I simply didn't know about it.

What made me realize it was a scam:

- the first thing that made me realize it was a scam was that both of the email senders said they were doctors who had bought the apartment themselves. That was a red flag to me because what are the odds of me being in contact with two apartment owners who are doctors? It was just strange, but I am sure they give themselves a high-end profession to earn the trust of their victims.

-They both said they had moved to another country and therefore couldn't show me the apartment themselves. I also felt like 'what are the odds they both can't show me irl?'

-They both felt the need to tell me that the reason the rent is low is because they own the apartment.

-Both asked for a 1000 dollar deposit..

--(why the clean, rounded number of 1000? and what are the odds that these two apartments in different sides of town wanted the same deposit amount?) this is when it started feeling like a scam template to me.

thanks for your post and I hope this scam becomes common knowledge.

[Victoria1851]

I contacted a woman whose profile is a girl under another name no followers etc but there are loads of them advertising flats all inclusive etc. so unfair as if it was my son he may of fell for it.  her email were as follows but her previous email was very curt as i asked if it was genuine 😂

Victoria

I hope this message finds you well and that I covered every aspect of this process so you don't get "surprised" at any point 

In order to make things happen (to schedule a viewing and move in), we will have to use a middle-man ( third party rental company/agency ) like Airbnb . They will take care of the logistic with, reservation/booking, inspection and handling the contract and handing over the keys. The rental contract will be a standard contract between You and me. Airbnb will not be involved into the rental process, you don't have to pay anything extra, I will support the fees of the entire process.

It will work like this, so please read all the information carefully:

To start the booking/reservation process, I will need your First and Last name, Your current home address, and your phone number ( as a secondary way of contact when you will have to schedule a viewing or you need to be informed about any matter, directly,  with no delay) and any kind of government issued document that clearly states your Full Name.

Therefore, a listing will be posted on Airbnb with all the information regarding my flat ( including pictures ).

You will receive an invitation to complete the reservation / booking.

Once the reservation / booking is confirmed and completed, you'll be contacted by one of their assigned Agent in a maximum of 3 days to schedule a viewing/inspection.

After the inspection, you will be presented the contract, so please read it carefully and if you decide to move in, you have to sign it, get the keys and move in. You can do that on the same day. As soon as the contract is signed.

The sooner you will complete the reservation process, the faster you will be able to view the apartment and move in.

If you agree with my terms and conditions, I need your Full Name, Phone Number, Your actual address and any kind of government issued document (attached).

Once you provide that information, I will forward it to Airbnb and the process will start.

[Yaqeen0]

Hello would you be able to help me figure out if this is a scam or not please im looking to book quickly n I have no experience with this 

https://abnb.me/xpwxUaYEinb

[Mary4962]

Hi guys please  i think the same woman is who my friend is dealing with. She claims she is I Germany. Please  @Risa793 could you reply to this so I can be sure If it's same woman

My friend has paid £900 for the 2 bed flat newly furnished as she claims. My friend did not do any viewings and now she is getting an email from the supposed agent saying that  the money was rejected because of the bank she is using and my friend should send another money. She said my friend will get a refund in the next 1p working days.

Please could you contact me.

[Risa793]

Hi Mary, please tell your friend to get the refund from the bank and run! Sounds like she already lost £900 and don't send them any more. Depending on the bank, if you file for a scamming incident the bank might be able to refund her. Please never pay a deposit before viewing the property. If the deal is too good to be true, it is likely a scam. In my case, her name is "Sophie Schmitt" and I just checked her Facebook profile, it's still active and she is still posting random posts like a normal Facebook user. But there are probably many, many scammers on Facebook with different names. 

[Anastasion0]

Just found out another scam like this, so I post the new names and emails of these fakes to inform people: 

** - I got a very long email from this old lady this time from Spain, **. Similar detailed story about kids and family. The rental price is very cheap for such a place. I asked the questions about the apartment in response mail and she replied to me 1 min after with the looong text also asking to send money "for Airbnb". Then I got into google and found this thread. 

Initial listing was found on facebook market, here is the link to the post: **

The name of the facebook "agent" was **

**[Personal details removed in line with the Community Center Guidelines]