problems with internet - a reason to ask for a refund?

[Igor19]

Hi,

i recently had a 2-week long stay and, while the apartment itself was good, i had big problems with the internet. They started about a week after i checked in, and the internet was out for half a day, then appeared again, then disappeared again for a long time the next day, and so on. For me internet = work, and no connection = lost income, and always before choosing a place to stay i confirm this with the host.

Well, unexpected connection issues may happen, of course; but what i didn't like in this particular case is that the owner kept telling me "she can't do anything about it". The internet provider confirmed to her that they were having problems in the neighborhood. I believe the host had enough time to try to find an alternative solution (as some hosts have done, in my past experience), such as providing me with a mobile modem or something like that.

After many days of connection problems i'd have moved out, if i had intended to stay longer... Anyway, i survived, but the question now is: is it ok to ask for a partial refund in such a case? I don't really want the host to have any problems in the future because of that, as the overall experience was quite nice. But then again, for half of the stay i missed the amenity which is crucial for me, and the host hasn't done anything to solve this critical problem. How would you proceed?

Thanks

[Sandra126]

@Igor19, Yes, hosts should give partial refund. They promised a service which was not there. It's the same as the fridge not working when you are promised a fridge. This is one reason I don't provide internet! I know for sure it would be intermittent and I would have complaints. I do promise a low-key tech-free break however...

[Ange2]

@Sandra126 @Elaine-and-Duane0 @Ephraim0 @Amaris0 @Igor19

I'm not sure. Of course one wants to do the best for one's guest and certainly not inconvenience them, but it's a thorny issue.

I have never received a refund when a hotel's internet has gone out, even a pricey hotel (occasionally, a free dinner or drink), nor an alternative fix, they say it's beyond their control. Sometimes a client I am working for will reimburse any out of pocket expenses for it.

The way I deal with this on my listing, even though I have two of the biggest and 'best' and only service providers in my neighborhood, is not to charge for the internet. It's free because I cannot guarentee it 100%. I also note that my listing is not a space for working.

[Amaris0]

@Ange2 I hear what you are saying but have to disagree re the example. If you book a hotel and one of the services they offer is wireless internet, then if that service is not working, the hotel is obliged to inform you at check-in and under the circumstances wave any cancellation fees if applicable should you wish to seek alternative accommodation. If a hotel is unable to fulfil its services, they might not advertise the refund but they cannot refuse a full refund prior to check-in or partial once checked in if you officially request it.

You mention it is a free service you offer, well it is not really free. It is an amenity you offer as part of the service when a guest pays to stay in you accommodation; you would not offer this free internet to your neighbour who is not paying for the accommodation, you only offer it in exchange to a guest paying. In addition, it is an advertise feature as such is an inaccurate listing if it does not have the services promised. It is like saying the guest have access to watch a TV and when they arrive there is no TV.

It's fine if one's internet service is not as strong or there are any issues but you need to be transparent and make it clear upfront in order that the guest is given the opportunity to make an informed decision. Compensating strictly out of pocket expense is not necessarily sufficient for example I gave an incident where I cancelled for a full refund due to internet not working, I had internet on my phone but my phone could not support the graphic apps my laptop holds. Using an internet cafe not only meant going in a direction out of my way, as there were not many around since most people have internet but it would also have eaten into my limited time and not in a comfortable environment. And no, I was not working it was for my personal use, just a  passionate hobby of mine.  In my case Airbnb made a full refund including their fees as well as gave me travel credit which came out of Airbnb’s pocket so cost Airbnb also as a result of the incorrect listing. 

It's one thing if amenities stop working during a guest's stay, such things happen but you must then discuss with your guest and offer suggestions or alternatives and you must be willing to work around their needs as well which might mean buying a sim card, getting internet credit bundle for their laptop, partial refund or other form of compensation as greed with the guest. Ultimately refunding for any days not spend in full if they request the option to cancel as a result of the lack of amenity / if you are unable to accommodate their chosen request because if they approach Airbnb and say the listing is not suitable for their needs without this service promised, then Airbnb will have no choice but to refund them for any days not spend.

It’s simple, if you offer something, ensure it is available or communicate effectively otherwise because it forms part of the contract between you and the guest.

[Ange2]

Hi. @Amaris0 The hotel example is not applicable, it was not before check in.  The guest was already checked in for a week before the internet stopped working,  he decided to stay for the following week despite knowing there was no internet and from what I read in his post his decision was not based on talk of a refund or compensation. Yes, the host should do everything they can to make sure they offer what is listed or come up with an alternative,  but the guest also needs to state their case at the time.  Just as a guest needs information to make an informed decision so does a host.  It cuts both ways. To me this was a total breakdown in communication.

From what I have read some hosts have said yes a refund is appropriate.  I still say - not so fast. Why wasn't it addressed at the time? Maybe there is more to the story that would make sense of it.  The few refunds I have been asked for were all resolved amicably at the time, not after the fact. It would make things clearer to know why this has been escalated to Airbnb and not resolved with the host. It would also be interesting to know what Airbnb decides and on what grounds.

Re: out of pocket not being acceptable recompense. The guest said early on that he only wanted to be compensated for his mobile usage, thus my reply was directed at how best to prepare for that. The guest did not mention a refund greater than covering his out of pocket expenses.

As to my interent. Yes it is free, and yes it works as well as can be expected of technology, I do not charge for it because on occasion it is unreliable, slow, like all internet. My mentioning it as not perfect is really a heads up for guests who expect perfection, some have.  And yes, I do allow my neigbors to use it when needed, at no charge. I live in a neighborly, neighborhood.  It really is a free amenity and not an inaccuracy as you appear to suggest.  If it went out I would conjure up an alternative, or an alternative place for the guest to stay.  I do not agree that it is "like offering a TV when you have no TV" just because it is free and not perfect.

[Ana7]

I agree with @Ange2

as it was out of the host's control, he really couldn't do anything about that and the guest knew that and decided to stay anyway.

[Igor19]

Thanks all for your replies. Good to know there are different opinions and arguments. But as the majority here thinks i have my reason, i will escalate it to airbnb and ask what they think. At least i know that's it not completely unethical to ask for a certain compensation.

I do think that the hotel analogy is a good one. Even more, i have had a couple of similar incidents on an airplane - where advertised wifi suddenly stopped working in the middle of the flight. I believe we all agree that wifi on board an airplane is not yet being treated as a matter of fact, as on the ground, but still every time i've got compensated by the airline.

As for moving out... well, that's always an option, of course, but that's the last resort, really. This was not the situation to move out, there was plenty of room to solve the problem. Finding another place with the same features and in exactly the same location is almost impossible - and i'm very sensitive to details and carefully choose a place based on many-many factors. Even so, it would take a lot of time, which once again for me is lost income. However, if internet would have stopped working for good, i certainly would have moved out. But this was not the case; it kept re-appearing every evening/night, which kept giving me hope that everything was finally fixed, and the next day all repeated.

And as for communicating with the host - well, as i described, the communication didn't work out. They kept telling me that it's the fault of the provider and they can't do anything. In this case, for the sake of my well-being and considering unpleasant previous experiences i had in life, i prefer to "survive" for a week without confrontments and then solve it thru airbnb, after all that's why we pay the airbnb fees, to have us protected. It's much easier to solve such incidents afterwards then wasting time and mental health in the process.

I'll let you know what airbnb's decision was.

[Ana7]

@Igor19 please do, I'm really curios what airbnb will decide!

[Amy38]

If you are this techie, you should certainly have been able to tether your cell phone at little or no cost to yourself.

[Rob208]

I am in a similar position - I don't know how much of a refund to ask for. The wifi I received was 0.02 Mbps, that's 20 kbps! 8 Mbps is typical for the area. The wifi was piggybacked from a neighbour using BTFON. No mobile data in the area either (rural Norfolk) - so tethering not an option unless you drive somewhere. The really annoying thing for me was that the listing says "wireless internet" but, on arrival, the house info admits that the internet is weak and suggests going to a pub or cafe for free wifi! So the host knew and didn't say. Then there's the problem of trying to sort this out when you're on holiday with no wifi! So what's a fair amount to ask for? Part of me wants a full refund plus a penalty for lying and making my holiday a lot worse than it should have been ... and another part of me wonders if it's possible that this was a genuine mistake. No, it must be deliberate.

[Harriet-and-Stu0]

@Rob208 did you already do your review?  I think letting other future guests know that the internet could be intermittent would be helpful.  I would suggest taking the high road  - leave out any 'fault finding' from the review.

However, if you do wish to pursue this through AirBnB (or have already), I think you cannot mention it in your review (or AirBnB could remove it from your review), since the matter would be considered 'open'...  

If your review is already submitted *and* you do not wish to go through AirBnB for resolution/compensation, you could if you wish (I think this is possible) message your host and suggest that they revise their listing to note the intermittent wifi due to the rural location.

Others will know better, I am a newbie!

[Rob208]

@Harriet-and-Stu0 - thanks for the suggestions. I don't intend to review until after the matter is resolved - and I will be careful to just state the facts when I review. My host has agreed to a partial refund, but no figures have been mentioned. So I was asking for suggestions. I see that many hosts tend to view stated amenities as *not* part of the contract, so if there's a problem it's not their problem. I'm fine with that, providing it's stated in the listing. What I'm not fine with is deliberate deception to secure bookings. 

Which? in the UK says this, which is an interesting thought ... "Under Section 75, the credit card company is jointly and severally liable for any breach of contract or misrepresentation by a company for items or services that cost between £100 and £30,000." I'm not sure how that could be applied to a partial refund though. 

[Harriet-and-Stu0]

@Rob208 sounds like you have a great handle on this 🙂

Credit card/contract approach is an interesting thought - although that could require a lot of time to document & pursue...

[Rob208]

I should add, the little Internet I could get was by standing up in the hallway! 

[David126]

I do not charge for Internet, I have it for my own use and am happy for Guests to use it, but I also live in the middle of nowhere and sometimes it goes down.

So far I have not had an issue but had thought of unticking the box and just saying it is there subject to availability.

I provide accomodation, not an internet cafe.

[Paul154 · Accepted solution]

600 Euros for 16 days?

That's 37.50 euros/day.

That is not a rate where a host can guarantee internet service with redundant service.

Nor is it a rate at which host can be generous giving out free money.

It is an amenity. Nice when it's there, but host is not going to get excited when it is down.

This is Airbnb, not a corporate business hotel. We are mere people who own a home and buy internet servcie, not IT specialists.

If one needs wifi for work, one should go to a hotel that guarantees internet.

@Igor0. Your stay was unpleasant because of the internet, but instead of leaving you stayed. I suspect you stayed because the place was adequate for the price. Keeping this in mind, asking for 10-15% off on the days the internet did not work, would be reasonable.