Infectious disease/ Corona Virus warning

[Melodie-And-John0]

Hello everyone, First, I think its rude to bring an uninvited guest like a virus to someones home or business wilfully but its even more horrible to share it with an innocent bystander that didnt even profit from their stay like the next guest who stays in the room.  Im not trying to freak out over what will probably end up to be just a minor thing at Bearpath Lodging but Im wondering if it would be prudent to put a general warning in our rules about not coming to our place and or cancelling if they are sick with an infectious disease or believe they may have been exposed to one?  We do a thorough cleaning and sanitizing of surfaces after every booking but this thing supposedly hangs out for up to 8 days after on surfaces and kids touch everything.  

Has anyone tried this and if so, what kind of feedback are you getting from it?  Inquiring minds want to know! Thanks and Safe Lodging!  John

[Dimitar27]

This information is old now. Remember the cruise ship "Diamond princess"?

"The coronavirus’ RNA “was identified on a variety of surfaces in cabins of both symptomatic and asymptomatic infected passengers up to 17 days after cabins were vacated.”"

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/23/cdc-coronavirus-survived-in-princess-cruise-cabins-up-to-17-days-aft...

[Melodie-And-John0]

@Ian-And-Anne-Marie0 , I work in the health sciences and there isnt actually a single scientifically accepted consensus on that, highly respected science and health professionals don't agree on the virility or all of the transference details of this contagion.  Some researchers believe it can live up to 8 days without a living host under optimal conditions whereas the typical flu is <2 days usually.  Neither of these is a good stat when you can have 4 or 5 different bookings regularly in a single space in a weeks time, thats allot of opportunities to share!  Best, John

[Ian-And-Anne-Marie0]

@Melodie-And-John0 

...So those were the words from a doctor fighting the infection in London's designated treatment hospital. Just shows how much is really known.

[Melodie-And-John0]

@Ian-And-Anne-Marie0 , its unfortunate that much of what we've gotten so far is anecdotal not really statistically confirmed.  The few things that everyone is sure about is that there are high risk individuals and they should definitely be aware that the dry cough and elevated temperature they are experiencing might be something very different than they have ever experienced.   

[Anonymous]

@Melodie-And-John0  In asking your guests to remove their shoes and observe quiet hours, you're only asking people to exercise behaviors within their control. That's very different from saying "you're not welcome here if you might be sick or possibly exposed to an infectious disease" (the latter of which includes literally everyone). 

It's always been the case that when someone stays in your home, there's a risk that they might be carrying a contagious disease, knowingly or unknowingly. That didn't start with the coronavirus.  Travelers also accept the risks of exposure that come with traveling and encountering other people; apart from cleaning the guest space it is not your job to manage that risk for them. 

You can moralize a virus or demonize the infected who don't immediately self-isolate if that makes you feel good, but it's not a sustainable solution. I just hope you consider how you'll want to be treated if it happens to you. Not everyone has the option of dropping everything and sealing themselves off from all other people for days at the first sign of a cough, especially in a place with 30 million uninsured people and millions more who don't have sick leave or the means to support themselves if they can't go to work, or affordable childcare if they have to isolate themselves from those in their care. 

Think about all the lives that might have been spared from AIDS if social and moral stigma hadn't stopped so many people from getting tested. Do you really want a repeat of that?

[Melodie-And-John0]

@Anonymous , Funny you should mention that, something like it did happen to me a couple weeks ago and I did self isolate for about 4 days away from my work and my airbnb customers, it was a viral upper respiratory infection and unlike way too many people that I work with (in academia!), I didn't choose to share it once I was aware I had something going on.  I didnt do cleanouts and even closed down one space for a few days that wasnt booked.   That seemed like the right thing to do and I couldnt help but think about direct and indirect effects of Covid on everyone while I was hiding in my bedroom feeling like I got hit by a car. I believe that was actually what caused me to consider asking sick folks not to visit our home. 

I hear what your saying about aids stigma, contracting it by casual contact, touching doorknobs and  inhaling airborne particles was ruled out pretty early yet folks still today spread rumors and misleading info that cause those afflicted, their friends and family members and others to act irrationally, receive threats and get discriminated against.  Thats not my way, I ask questions and seek answers that can help me develop an informed and actionable decision, thats what Im doing here, why I wrote this thread.  It seems like the consensus from hosts here  is that would be alarmist and overreaction so for now, I will stick to the shoes and noise clauses and hope people will use a bit of common sense before they spread something they cant unspread, Thanks again for the feedback, have an awesome day, John

[Anonymous]

@Melodie-And-John0  I appreciate that you chose to engage the community on what is a difficult issue for all of us. It's a conversation well worth having. 

My view here is that it's not an overreaction to take precautions for your own health, which might ultimately mean there's no business as usual. But we're dealing with another pathogen that might be transmissible by people who aren't "sick," and who have no reason to know they were exposed to it. Asking guests to do the risk assessment for you is just not a viable strategy. Either you honor the bookings of all those who choose to come with the awareness that any of them could turn out to be a carrier, or you stop hosting until you feel safe doing so again. 

[Melodie-And-John0]

Quick funny story to lighten things up, a friend of mine and I saw Ian Anderson (Jethro Tull Lead)  at a local casino about 5 years ago and we had meet and greet passes to mingle with him after the show.  My friends instinctively held out his hand to shake Ian's and he pulled back saying it was common in his industry to bump elbows instead of shake hands just because he meets so many people and that exposes him and others to an undesirable sharing of bugs.  So we all bumped elbows, had a quick chat with him and neither of us got close enough to smell each others locomotive breath!  My purple circle just grew to 6', a customary country nod is about the closest contact I'm going to have with strangers for the foreseeable future!  JR

[Melodie-And-John0]

Heres a quick news flash from a good friend of mine who was born in and lives in Chongqing China ,not far from the epicenter of the Coronavirus.   She has been updating us every week or so on how things are going and she has been very upbeat (she always is).  She and all of her region were quarantined as of the end of January when she wrote, "China is on Vacation", it was funny yet sad, its literally millions of people mostly not living in palatial housing complexes.   A few weeks ago when we were chatting about the outbreaks in the USA, she told me her advice was

" You must take good protective measures, it is best not to go out, wear a mask at the exit, avoid contact with people, eat preventative foods like onions, garlic and citrus".  (and yes, China required them to wear a mask when outside).   

They are just now beginning  to return back to work.   Schools will reopen soon and life will return to somewhat normal.   Thats less than 1 1/2 months from quarantined in the middle of a national outbreak to back to work.   Jinmei's is highly educated and a world traveler, her advice wasn't necessarily what were doing now but its interesting to know what  she experienced in the middle of it all.  The story does seem to have an ending that isnt Flu-mageddon! John 

[Melodie-And-John0]

So last night I got my first Corona cancellation (6 nights over 3 weeks, ouch).  About 20% of my guests are here for one of two colleges/ universities within 10 minutes of Bearpath Lodging and one just announced they will teach online for at least 2 weeks after spring break and added a number of other temp restrictions.  Im also an employee of that University so normal wont be showing up in my life for awhile I suspect.  Add to that that our governor just shut down an entire county and activated out national guard to Deliver chow and disinfect Rockland, this just got a bit more real for NY and surrounding areas.  There are literally 5 states much closer to that county than our Airbnb so get ready for some turbulence in the market for a bit  on the North Eastern seaboard.   Im praying that an early spring might bring an early end to seasonal virus's and hopefully  Covid 19 with it.

[Melodie-And-John0]

Looks like it will be necessary to write the warning I started this thread about, people are taking themselves out of the mix ahead of the problem!  2 more cancellations this morning, this isnt going to be a banner year....

[Ian-And-Anne-Marie0]

@Melodie-And-John0 

The range is from cautious to cavalier it seems! (Our range of family and friends bear this out).

The cautious are solving your problem and doing what you would want, whilst hitting your wallet. The cavalier will there come hell or high water and cause you your problem.

Sometimes, you just can't win.

[Melodie-And-John0]

@Ian-And-Anne-Marie0 , well stated. Theres gonna be some bumps and bruises on the way to better days.  If nothing else, we will most likely all gain a new respect for basic prevention measures like washing hands and employers and employees respecting the need to take and give time to be sick at home and encourage folks to use it when its indicated.  stay well everyone!

[Marg11]

Very grateful to be able to cancel our Airbnb bookings. If we went to the US wedding and visited relatives as planned,  we would have had to self isolate for a fortnight on return to Australia. Our re-entry via Sidney to visit family this would have been a tad difficult.

Our Airbnb is closed for 6 weeks when we would have been away so will do some renovations and maybe go camping. Fortunately, our bookings from the end of next week are Aussies with no cancellations so far as we are in our 70s and he is in the 4% vulnerable. Another reason to not travel.

Already changed cleaning and now preparing to add a few pages to our 'house rules' folder.

[Melodie-And-John0]

So a week ago, I decided that I would address the elephant in the room in our listings and Im pretty sure the communications we had here caused me to rethink the tone and approach for the better so here it is-

"Dear concerned and valued Guests, Melodie and I have always committed to delivering a high quality, clean, safe and comfortable stay for a reasonable price as hundreds of excellent reviews attest.  Recent public health concerns about the Coronavirus/ Covid 19 spread world wide require us as Hospitality hosts to consider all the things we can do to help ensure Bearpath Lodging remains a safe place for guests (and hosts).  The following are some of the things we have always done to provide safe spaces for our guests and their fellow travelers. 
 
 -The cancellation policy we subscribe to allows guests to cancel bookings up to 24 hours prior to checkin and happily refund our portion of the booking because things happen that are not within your control or ours.  To be perfectly honest, we would rather a guest cancel their stay, get a refund and encourage you to rebook when your able if you have concerns you have an illness that may be contagious. 

-Our Suites have no shared spaces, each has its own private bathroom and entrances that are not shared with other guests.  The heating system is hot water radiators not recirculated forced air and air conditioning is provided using separate appliances in local areas not central air.

-As your hosts, we personally take pride in doing a thorough and effective job of cleaning our spaces for every guest and are taking extra care to disinfect surfaces that might retain germs or viruses before all stays and during longer stays.  Every guest is also assured clean linens, towels and washcloths.  Please understand that proper preparation takes time to complete, early check in prior to 3:00 may not be possible."

We believe this is a positive way to recognize the here and now and what comes for us and to be sure, were not doing significantly more than we've ever done except more surface disinfecting and a little less handshaking but I think its a good thing to recognize we are always trying to consider our common and varied needs and concerns.  Im still getting bookings so I guess its not shocking, stay well, John