Review dilemma as a guest.....

[Kia272]

So, I recently stayed at an AirBnB in Wyoming with three friends. We actually stayed twice, on either end of a backpacking trip. The first stay was two nights and the second stay one night. The host was kind of into automated messaging, which is fine, but it was obvious they were automated. 

There were several small issues during both stays. First, not enough toilet paper. We were 4 people staying for two days, and we were left one and a (barely) half rolls of toilet paper. There were no supplies in the place, because we looked. We would simply have grabbed an extra roll if there was one in the house, and not mentioned it. We did end up buying some, and brought it with us when we returned (because we had it). For the second stay there was one roll and barely a quarter roll in the bathroom. We were 4 females, so definitely would require more than a mixed group of males and females. 

There were a couple of small things that could have been improved, that would not have cost much to fix. First, there was a rusty old medicine cabinet attached to the wall in the bathroom. It served no purpose- there was nothing in it, and it was definitely an eyesore. It could have been removed completely and that would not have affected the bathroom function at all. The shower curtain bar was rusty. That's a cheap fix. The shower curtain liner was moldy, but that's a cleaning issue. Overall, the place was very clean, so I wouldn't have dinged her stars for that, but might have mentioned it in private feedback. 

One hook in the bathroom to hang a wet towel. We were 4??? Also, microfiber bedding but hey- I can't dictate what bedding other hosts should use- it's just a pet peeve of mine. But with no A/C, cotton would certainly be cooler on the skin. 

There was no A/C, which I was aware of when we booked. There were two tiny tabletop oscillating fans, that didn't do much to move air. No ceiling fans at all. The place was really hot and stuffy when we arrived, which could have been remedied by the host stopping in and opening some windows before we got there, but that didn't happen. Yes- there was a local co-host right in the area. 

My biggest problem is that the host asked repeatedly- in messages and her house manual, "Please leave us a 5 star review." Not, "please leave us an honest review, ", or "please let us know how we can improve." 

At this point, I haven't left a review. The overall experience was not 5 star. Something as small and inexpensive to fix, like enough toilet paper, definitely left a sour taste. As a host, I know I have definite ideas about what good hospitality entails, and I do realize that my standards may not necessarily align with those of other hosts, so I'm taking into account that I may just be too opinionated, and perhaps I'm not justified in my assessment of the situation. I had decided to not leave any review at all, but now I'm soliciting opinions. I don't know if I even want to make the effort to let her know via private feedback what a turn-off being asked for a 5 star review is. 

I don't feel that these things are something that other guests need to be "warned" about, so I'm not feeling particularly guilty about not leaving reviews. 

Thoughts from other hosts? 

Kia

[Huma0]

@Kia272 

I'll try to respond point by point:

- I'm not a fan of only receiving automated messages, but it seems a lot of hosts do this, so I wouldn't factor that in to your rating.

- A lot of hosts state that they just supply a starter amount of things like toilet paper, not supplies for the whole stay and that it's up to the guest to buy the remainder of these. Judging by what I've read on the CC, this is more common than you think, so I don't think it's necessarily such a big deal. The host might have even mentioned something along these lines on the listing. It's hard to know without seeing it. 

- Bathroom hook, rusty medicine cabinet and shower rail: are these things shown in the listing photos? If so, I don't think you can ding for it. Remember, it's up to the guest to check the listing and decide if it's suitable for them and if the price is reasonable BEFORE booking. Don't expect what's not offered. If, on the other hand, the photos are misleading in terms of the condition of the listing/amenities, and it was presented as more luxurious or in better condition than it was, then by all means, mark down for accuracy and maybe value.

- Likewise for AC and fans. If they are not offered, you should not mark down. As for the windows, was this a self check in or in person? If self-check in, it might not have been feasible to leave windows open before your arrival for security reasons. Who knows? Other guests might complain on finding open windows that the listing was not properly secured. If there were no screens on the windows, it might have been to keep out bugs.

- If the place was very clean over all and it was only the shower liner curtain thingy that was not, I wouldn't take off a whole cleanliness star just for that. I would maybe just tell the host in private feedback.

- RE asking for the 5 star review, this seems to be your biggest peeve. It's not something I would do personally, but a lot of hosts do because most guests do not understand how Airbnb's rating system actually works and that everything below 5* is considered sub-standard. Still, it does depend on the way you were asked, and it sounds a bit much to me.

I have not seen the listing, nor did I stay at it, so it's hard to say, but I think I would probably knock a star off for communication (for blatantly asking for the 5 star review) but not be too harsh in the ratings otherwise.

Personally, I find hosts are often tricky guests, especially when they come with an attitude of, "This is how I do things at my listing,". On the other hand, I think I am probably much more generous when I rate other hosts than I would have been if I had never been a host myself. I can appreciate all the work that goes into it and also that, on Airbnb, 5* does not have to mean 'perfect'.

[Kia272]

@Huma0  Thanks for the reply. 

I agree with much of what you said, with a couple of exceptions. I did acknowledge that I am very opinionated about what good hosting entails, and perhaps my standards don't align with those of other hosts. 

This was definitely a clean, basic budget accommodation. I knew that when I booked. It was a purely practical decision, and I wasn't expecting any kind of luxury. However, toilet paper isn't a luxury, it's a necessity. For a two day stay, I want enough toilet paper, and I don't want to have to go out and buy some. My point is that it's such a cheap and easy fix. ONE extra roll of toilet paper would have made this a non-issue. I understand that with extended stays, I would not expect a host to keep supplying and supplying, but this just seems like a poor decision/oversight by the host. 

Also, if you can accommodate 4 guests, then have 4 hooks in the bathroom. That's all I can say about that. 

I also said that I would not have dinged any stars for the shower curtain, and might simply have mentioned it in private feedback. 

The big issue for me was being asked multiple times for a 5 star review. I completely understand that the AirBnB review/star system is completely skewed. However, we then get into a chicken/egg situation. When a host simply asks for 5 star reviews, that also makes a mockery of the system. Is it justified in reaction to AirBnB's messed up system? Chicken and egg. Which came first? 

I guess I simply don't understand why- budget accommodation or not- a host wouldn't make minor/inexpensive changes that overall improve their property and leave less room for guests to have issue with. 

Me? I do things like buy towels in 4 different colors. Buying a big batch of the same color towels is cheaper, but I thought that if 4 adults were staying, and nobody could tell their towel apart from anyone else's, that would be annoying. Simple things like that make a big difference to guests. But I digress.....

Overall, it just wasn't a 5 star stay. Yes, I have stringent standards for my own hosting, but I'm trying to be generous to this host. Asking for the 5 star review over and over was a big turn-off for me. Hence my decision to leave no review at all. I'm sure she's puzzled. I'm not sure I have the energy or inclination to message her and tell her why. 

[Huma0]

@Kia272 

I am with you about the toilet paper. For me, it's a pretty basic thing and I also wouldn't want to have to go out and buy some for such a short stay. It's not the cost, it's the inconvenience. I host long term guests and they NEVER have to buy their own toilet paper. That's just something I ensure is there.

However, I've seen so many hosts on the CC state that they don't expect to supply toilet paper for a whole stay, just some to get the guests started. So, perhaps it was an oversight, or perhaps that's just what this host does as standard. Who knows? I had a guest who told me she was unhappy about a previous airbnb she stayed at for two days (with a friend) because there was only 1.5 rolls of toilet paper. She messaged the host to request more, but was firmly told no, if she needed more, she should buy it herself. My point was that it's maybe more common than you think!

Asking for a 5 star review over and over is a turn off. Okay, maybe it's okay to ask once (with the right wording, so that it's not a demand or expectation), but not again and again. 

Anyway, if you do not feel it was a 5* stay, then you don't need to rate 5*. The last listing I stayed at, there were what I felt were quite major issues with communication, plus there were a few other little annoyances. I rated the host down a star on communication, but gave her 5 overall, because I felt like other things (a really decent breakfast) made up for that. If you don't feel that there was anything that made up for the faults (all other things considered) there is no compulsion to leave 5*, even if the host kept asking for it. 

It probably wouldn't hurt to message her to politely explain why, but if you feel she won't be receptive to it, perhaps there is no point.

[Clara116]

@Kia272 @Huma0 

Interesting post for sure - your response to Huma was most curious to me. You have asked for opinions and spent a little time here with back and forth and I've looked at your property so here's my opinion about the situation. My guess time is about up and you now you can't review the property - which I hope is not the case. 

You seem to be must put off by 1 roll of TP - and asking for a 5* Review. 

I too would not want to go buy TP for a 1 or 2 night stay - for that matter, I hate it - and once had to do it for a 4 nights stay for 2 of us and I didn't like it but I didn't feel like it was a deal breaker - however, I know or have met very few Hosts that know everything going in - and many of us learn from private feedback, reviews and messages or conversations from our guests. Why not be a generous host and share your feedback like you did with Huma - perhaps the hosts didn't think about 4 hooks/4 colors towels - tell them about the TP situation for YOU. Please don't expect them to know, understand and fix things if they don't get the feedback about it. I just do not understand why guests/hosts have such a "fear" of leaving honest reviews about their experience as a guest...?? Esp. remote hosts that aren't nearby - which seems to be a recent influx of them on airbnb these days. How can they improve if they don't hear from you the guest??

Could be someone/another host just maybe told them just leave 1 roll of TP - cause that's how they do it -  and tell guests to get more for their stay - not realizing how this comes off to many people esp. 1 -2 night stays - 

I'd really be curious how many times on the message thread to you they asked for 5*s and how many times in the guest book/manual it was mentioned?? 

You write you are trying to be generous -- OK, I think by messaging the host your list and being honest is the generous way to go -  also telling other guest to bring TP with would be the generous move. Not leaving a review makes little sense to me ?? It appears rather like its beneath you or something like that?? I don't like even imagining that!!  Help me here - I'm being honest (as I see it) in my post - it is meant to be helpful only.

Happy Hosting, happy guesting,

Clara

[Kia272]

@Clara116  I'm not sure how you got the idea that leaving a review is beneath me ?? I thought I was going the host a favor, because I didn't feel I could leave a 5 star review. I had some issues that might not bother others, and I don't want to affect her livelihood. 

I was asked 3 times in the (automated) message thread, and one time in her house manual. Point blank: Please leave us a 5 star review. 

Even if another host told them to leave one roll (??), could she not ponder that and decide that it's not enough? Hospitality should be organic. It should stem from the host's feelings about a place they would like to stay, and what should be supplied there. So I don't think that's a valid excuse. 

And yes, I am struggling with this. Society trains us to be "nice", and to avoid confrontation. I can be bossy and opinionated, but this is a stranger. I know nothing about her, and would not want to ding her without giving her the chance to improve. Private feedback would allow for that without affecting her publicly. I'm trying to be nice, but apparently I'm making a hash of it. That's all I got...

[Debra300]

@Kia272,

I can understand why there wasn't a large surplus of toilet paper.  I just had French guests this past weekend, and we provided an almost full jumbo roll on the TP holder and a spare jumbo roll.  They (female and male) stayed for two nights, and when they left the spare roll was gone, but there was ample remaining on the holder.  That's not the first time this has happened, but it irks me, and may affect when we leave extra toilet paper.

I think that four females traveling together should have been better prepared, and am surprised that there was a need to go buy more after reaching the rental.  Whether I am sightseeing in the city or exploring nature, it's my practice to carry toilet paper with me when I am going to be outside for extended periods of time, because it's not consistently available.   If I were traveling with three other females there is no way that I would have needed to go buy some toilet paper, especially since I know that some folks like to roll the paper around their whole hand until it looks like a mummy wrap.

Even when I visited @Ann72's wonderful place this past spring where there was ample TP, no rusty bathroom fixtures, and impeccably clean shower curtains, I still had my own supply for when Keep Cool and I went out.

[Kia272]

@Debra300 I love almost everything you post, but on this one, I'm going to have to disagree. 

First of all, I put out lots of toilet paper for my guests. I figure it's about a dollar a roll these days. I've never had a guest pilfer any of it, but if I did, no big deal. In the larger scheme of things, it's cheap, and I'd rather they take that than something more expensive that I value. 

Regardless, I expect any place that I am paying to stay at to supply sufficient toilet paper for a two-night stay. That wasn't the case here. 

I don't carry toilet paper, and neither do my friends. Incidentally, we all had the trendy new "pee cloths" that one takes on a backpacking trip (good for the environment, no toilet paper to haul around in the wilderness) but if I'm using indoor plumbing, I'm sure as heck not going to use that thing. The point is, there simply should have been enough. There wasn't. 

I think this is all about choosing your battles (as a host), and this is one I don't care to battle over. A couple of dollars worth of "lost" toilet paper is way less expensive than a poor review. That's how I see it. 

[Debra300]

@Kia272,

Yep, we will agree to disagree.  

[Kelly149]

@Kia272 I've been a super host since ?2016? so I've gotten to use a few stay vouchers. In all instances, I booked the place that was the nearest to meeting my parameters and you know what, I haven't thought any of them were 5* places. Still in all instances I either left a 5* review or none at all and I only ever offered the barest of private feedback suggestions, bc really most people want to do what they want to do without hearing opinions from strangers.

So, I said they weren't 5* places but that's what I left them and here's why, ABB believes that anything other than a 5 is abject failure. So, did you have an adequate stay or was it bottom of the barrel should never host anyone again? Cause the first answer is a 5* and the second is a 4*.

Knowing what we do about ABB, if it were me, I'd give a 5 Overall, 4 Communication, 4 Cleanliness and then write the text portion to say "communicative off-site host, with a sparse budget accommodation. Guests who bring their own toilet paper, soaps, xxxx, etc will be close to xyz and outside of scorching August the lack of AC will probably be ok for most people."

[Huma0]

---

@Kelly149 wrote:

So, I said they weren't 5* places but that's what I left them and here's why, ABB believes that anything other than a 5 is abject failure. So, did you have an adequate stay or was it bottom of the barrel should never host anyone again? Cause the first answer is a 5* and the second is a 4*.

---

Ditto.

[Kia272]

@Kelly149  I think I've decided on not leaving  a review. It's the lesser hurt of giving an honest review. I completely understand that if the listing is as described, be it luxury or barebones, the host deserves credit for that in the form of a review.

Although I have different views on how to host, that doesn't mean I get to dictate them to the whole hosting world. I get that. 

The blatant asking for a 5 star review multiple times just rubbed me the wrong way. No review is the best outcome, I think. 

Thanks for your input. Kia

[Kelly149]

@Kia272 I don't disagree that the 5* pandering is annoying, but I'd err on the side of reviewing if even only for the purpose of warning all future travelers that they should pack some TP

[Karen114]

@Kia272  I think it's fine not to leave a review.  I have done the same with guests that didn't do anything wrong per se  but just rubbed me the wrong way. Doesn't happen often thankfully.

In my opinion I think you should share with the host from one host to another privately about the TP, shower curtain and the 5 star review bit.  If she is using a co host she is likely out of state and maybe the co host just isn't that discerning when it comes to cleanliness. 

I had the very same issue with shower curtain.  Guest told me in a private message that shower curtain was orange on bottom.  I was so thankful and immediately sent my cleaners new shower curtain via Amazon.  It's tough when you operate out of state and use others as your eyes and ears.  At the end of the day they are not us. 

A rising tide lifts all boats 🙂

[Kia272]

@Kelly149 

I hear you. I guess that once we all fall victim to AirBnB's messed up review system, it becomes a complete failure. 

Yes, I would stay there again. I just wish the review system were more balanced and fair. 

Kia