Doing the right thing is penalising hosts

Robin4
Level 10
Mount Barker, Australia

Doing the right thing is penalising hosts

A lot of posts recently have complained about poor star ratings based on things like 'Value' and 'Location' .

 

I am finding the same thing! People are loving their stay, say what a lovely lot of extras are provided and how they enjoyed the experience, but I am getting an increasing number of 4 stars. My 5 stars are now down to 91% from 98% a month ago.

I think it is tied up with the new system Airbnb have introduced for guests to rate their experience.

Airbnb are now actively asking guests in the review process what faults they found with the listing or the experience. Airbnb are prompting guests on such things as floors and carpets, temperature, smells, noise, even 'bugs' for goodness sake.

No longer is the guest asked......'Were you impressed with the cleanliness of the listing'?...a positive statement.

They are now asked.....'What was the main issue relating to the cleanliness of the listing' ......a negative statement.

I would guess many guests would have thought some trivial little issue not worth mentioning until Airbnb bought it up and required a response.

To put it in perspective, a 5 star is still a 5 star, just as it always has been, and if a guest simply clicks that 5 star in a particular category and ignores Airbnb's prompts, they move on to the next category. But if a guest decides to check what happens if they click 4 stars or less, that's the time the negative boxes and statements appear.

I have not been a guest under this new review process and what I have said here is pieced together from the sketchy information that is now coming to the forum from Lisa, Andrea and others, but I have seen enough of it to in future warn my guests what will happen in the review process, and how 'thinking you are doing the right thing' is in actual fact penalising the host. I have printed my 'Stats' page of one month ago showing my percentages and I have printed my current 'Stats' page to illustrate just what a couple of 4 star reviews does to the host. I showed it to my most recent guests who left here yesterday and they were genuinely shocked to see the result…..particularly when shown what happens to hosts who fall below a particular percentage level!

It seems, in a way, unethical to have to manipulate the system like this, it's almost scaring people into giving a 5 star, it's getting away from the genuineness of the review. But, that is what Airbnb are doing and I am just trying to fight back in any way that I can.

How do others feel about this?

Cheers....Rob

46 Replies 46

@Sharla0 - interesting perspective! I never felt Airbnb was working for us hosts, in my opinion it's clearly the other way around, we are working for them! That's how it makes sense when they change things, dictate new parameters to us hosts, and all without having to ask for our permission or feedback - exactly how most employers deal with their employees. 

As for another company stepping in and picking up the slack: I don't see that anytime soon, Airbnb is just too big and omnipotent right now. They are probably just doing the smart thing - for them - adjusting to new market demands, etc. Seems to me that more and more new customers are flocking to Airbnb, expecting hotel service.... thus the newer 4 star reviews. As little as guests are  paying  attention to the finer points in listings, I doubt they are analyzing each host's star ratings, they just see the stars all over the place, as they are for most listings, and book.

Also, there seems to be no shortage of new hosts signing up, so for right now, Airbn is  sitting pretty and doesn't need us hosts to like them....with the changing times, I have the feeling that the old idea of hosting and providing a personlized service  is getting tossed out of the window. We better adjust to it....

 

Veronica160
Level 2
United States

If Airbnb and perceptive guests didn't penalize us so this star system would be ok but as we all have experienced it is a significant penalty when you are less than 5 stars.
Not only that ratings are all relative! To one guest you are a 5 star and to another who is getting the exact same propertry with all the same amenities is a 4 star or less. It is only an opinion and may not be reality! To some my property is the best they have ever had and to another it isn't for some petty reason or no reason at all! That is exactly what one guest said, he gave me a 4 star for no reason! I do not believe in this system at all. It is not balanced, it tilts towards the guests and gives them the power to manipulate us hosts

hi @Veronica160 , yes, we all have our beef with the existing  rating system - and more so with how Airbnb is using it against us hosts. So it's Airbnb, not the guests really, that is manipulating us.

Most guests don't even know or understand the scrutiny we undergo as hosts, they just make their rating marks (if at all) and are done...and they should be done: they are on vacation and don't deserve to be educated (or begged..) by us hosts to please give us that 5 star review. Again, it's up to Airbnb to educate the guests and let them know a rating has consequences for a host - and they don't!  

Some guests totally want to be left alone, some do appreciate the personal touches, some expect service and amenities at a modestly priced Airbnb listing as if they were in a 4 star hotel. Nothing we can do about most of those iffy parameters, so I just let it all go and simply do my best, which so far is working out very well 🙂

But I have noticed in my reviews that guests almost always mention us by name and apparently go away feeling very well taken care of by us - and that translates into great ratings, and perhaps a more forgiving attitude should something go wrong during their stay. Also, if we as hosts offer genuine personal care, that makes it so much  harder  for guests to come out with criticism!

That dynamic  tells me that most guests still appreciate the personal touches, like we have a nice profile section up on us, not just the name.  We greet every guest when they arrive, no exception, and we touch base with them by message after the first night to ask if all is okay -then we leave the guests alone. That seems to be the right amount of involvement - and I can only recommend it highly to other hosts.  

Good luck you all!

Annette

 

Robin4
Level 10
Mount Barker, Australia

@Annette33

Hi Annette, I just tried to answer your DM but mine is still playing up I am afraid! Every time I hit the 'send message' tab a caption comes up that says 'Oops, can't send your message just now' and it simply disappears as though I never wrote it.

That's three times in the last couple of days so, I have to almost forget about DM and I will post it here, I don't think there is anything too personal in it.

 

"I reckon the day is not far off when  we could savour a bottle together even though being ocean apart! These days there is 'virtual' this and that....virtual cigarettes....why not virtual booze!!! Geez Diane would tick me off using all those!!! Oh did it again..

 

I really and truly didn't mean to ignore you in that post Annette and to tell you the truth, Friday was a bad day for me...As I said first to water the garden (we have this string of 37c days) , then attend to Ade's mobility bit, then off to Meals on Wheels, and as luck would have it we had a long term kitchen volunteer give it away on Friday, so my assistant and I decided to have a farewell lunch and a few bottles of bubbles to farewell her. That is not good Annette, when you hit the grog that early in the day!

 

Anyway, attended to all the other stuff, got the cottage ready, welcomed the guests and they joined us in a drink or two...as you do, and then Ade and I went to a neighbours for a pre-arranged......drink or two. By the time 9.00pm came around I did find walking home a bit difficult. I did do a couple of short posts, one of them to @Lizzie, but I found ever word I typed I had to correct so, Annette....you dipped out! Sorry about that. No reflection on you!

 

Talk again soon cheers.....Rob

@Robin4 , all good Rob, I got your previous message - nothing to worry about!

Robin4
Level 10
Mount Barker, Australia

@Annette33 @Andrea

Hey, I have just updated the photos and captions on my site! When you get the opportunity have a look and tell me what I should improve....I value the judgement of both of you and your knowledge....

Cheers for a hot Mt Barker.....Rob

So @Robin4 , tried several times to send you a DM, but the system tells me, oops, can't send it right now --- so I am posting it here, as I gave it some thought and would like you to know about it:

Hey Rob,
 so here is my honest input:
first of all, your place is GREAT, and it sure shows that you are taking care of all the details in a loving way!! (love me some explanation points!!). That is they overriding message, but - since you asked -  here are some "critical" detail suggestions:
1.) I see you are experimenting now also with IB. I go in and out of it. have not seen a difference in inquiries, views, booking requests, or most importantly placing on the Airbnb site, so I think the overall anxiety in the community forums about IB is overblown. Still, my anxieties rise a bit with IB, had 3 bookings with that so far, no problems, but now, as the season is picking up, I'm back to "normal" booking. With a search, I found your place on the second page of  the 142 Mount Barker listings - about the same place where I find mine on the Prescott listings  = all good!
2.) Your photos and descriptions:
photos: When I am nitpicking,  I am wondering about your cover photo: while lovely, a lot of the photo is taken up by that huge shrub. Can you get on a ladder and retake that photo from a slightly better/higher angle? In comparison to other listing, your pic seems "darker", which could mean less inviting…. I  like photo 5 ( the bed) best. very inviting and it would look great as the cropped horizontal cover photo. I have gotten 3 bookings within 36 hours after I changed my outside shot to a living room shot. worth experimenting with. Or perhaps photo 12 as the cover shot (crop off 1" off the garage on the right), but I'm not sure if the dog in there is that appealing (but it would not show in the cropped image) ?
I am missing a photo of the sitting area, I only get a hint of it in photo 2 on the left side. Also, perhaps retake the bathroom pic and have it come out less yellow. otherwise, pics are great!
description of the pics:
there is quite a bit of extra "advertising" in there, perhaps a bit much for my liking, like the best bed ever, costs a fortune, the detailed and itemized description of your goodies, you won't intrude but you'll show hospitality in style. Overall, get the "we" and "I" out of every description you give, might make people feel that actually you are there all the time, watching, as you also say how much you like hanging out in the garden, etc…at the same time, don't be defensive about anything , like: it looks a bit flat, but… and the concrete is old , but….also explaining your no pets rule in house rules: just do it without explaining it….you might be overthinking it all!! People these days will not read all the details anyways, but might actually  get turned off by too much detail.
3.) some more general pointers:
I would definitely change your listing from "private room" to "entire home/apt". that is what it is, so why not catch the people who look for that in the search parameters? wondering if 2 beds (the fold out sofa)/3 people is wise, especially with IB on? I had the same set up, changed it to 1 bed and 2 people only - and I feel much better about that! If people need more, we can always arrange it per message, but it is not expected or promised from the get go. And how about experimenting with a minimum of 2 nights? How much less would you get in bookings? what is your history with that? especially with all the goodies you are rolling out, 2 nights makes so much more sense ( and less work for you!!).
re goodies: I am scaling back bit, like only putting a bottle of wine out for 3/4 days stay, not 2 nights anymore. Often enough, people don't even touch the cheese platter or the other goodies I have prepared, etc..so I am leaning towards less "advertising" or promising it in my description,  just doing it , or spontaneously bringing them some home baked muffins and having the guest be pleasantly surprised, instead of expecting it - which might actually translate into more appreciation and great reviews! Same for your posted list of all the things that you do before a guest arrives ( if you still have that up in your place, a while ago you talked about it) :  to me, that is a bit of overkill - guests just want to be in a clean space, let them judge it for themselves, they don't want to know in detail all the little steps we took to prepare the space for them, it's just too much info.
Reviews: I don't think it's wise to get our guests involved in any of that, like how unfair the system is, how detrimental 4 star ratings are, asking them to send you screen shots, showing them your stats page, etc.. perhaps you got your latest 4 stars precisely because you talked about it and made it into an issue? just a thought…guests want to be guests, without feeling any obligation, they pay, so there is the fair exchange. It is all about THEM, not us hosts. Just relax about that whole thing, will ya? Being crushed because someone doesn't leave you a review is detrimental to your mental health! I leave people alone with any of that - but yes, as I am interested in  keeping my super host status,  I just watch that I need more than 50% reviews of people who have actually stayed. So occasionally, when I want another review, I review people first, that inevitably prompts them to leave a review themselves (cause they are curious to read it asap) = mission accomplished. I also believe that routinely leaving a longer response under a review than the review is itself is not helpful, it doesn't make you shine, it actually might make people think that you are a tad too eager.
Hey, Rob, those are all just my opinions, take it all with a grain of salt, and please, please  don't be offended.. I am really trying to be helpful, not detrimental: go back to paragraph 1:  You got a great listing!

Cheers,

Annette

 

Robin4
Level 10
Mount Barker, Australia

@Annette33...I know another day has gone by and I have not responded! It is now 12.40am Friday morning  and I am going to give it away fro the day. Thank you so much for your comments Annette I so value your critique. Most of what you have said I will act on although with slight trepidation. Most of my bookings are coming from people who like that 'patter'! They feel like they are to a extent certain more comfortable taking that leap into the great unknown because they suddenly feel involved with the listing.....they feel they are special. My comments about cheese and wine plates are genuine and many guests have taken that up and have not expected more than they got, they received exactly what they expected!

The front of my house is 'daggy' for want of a better word! It's just the entrance to the house, we don't live out the front, we live out the back! And on a number of occasions guests have rung the front doorbell and have said....are we at the right place in a tone that almost says they hope I will say they aren't. But as soon as they come around the corner into the rear garden and I show them into the cottage they just melt...."Oh, it's just like it is in the pictures"...of course it is but, that first perception when they pulled up out the front was....'bloody hell, what have we got ourselves into here'

Everything with hosting is a mind game Annette, you do have to surprise the guest, and I do have to make them feel that they were important in my life, they were special.....that is why most of them have come here, they want to be hosted.

I don't have a cleaning fee, a security deposit or anything other than a flexible cancellation policy....I am at the bottom of the add-ons ladder. but I have never felt I need to protect myself. All my guests to this point have been marvelous...and apart from a few broken plants before christmas I could not have wished for better guests.

I guess one of my main concerns was posting that personal photo last....is that too much info. My thoughts were it is already there in my profile but I needed to say....hey, hello there, this is real, this is us!

Thanks for your great comments....yes you have got me thinking on how to delete so many personal references but things like showing Betts....she is a big part of this listing and guests need to know if they come here, Betts will be in their lives. They will love her just as she will love them and she has been known to cry when a guest leaves, so I feel it is as important to introduce her as it is myself.

Bugger me it's 1.00am now and I am on duty in that kitchen again in the morning....thanks Annette, help like yours is wonderful and I will alter things to reflect your input.....watch this space!

Cheers.....Rob

Cari3
Level 10
Vancouver, WA

Ow wow that makes such sense...when i look at the last review i received.  What bothers me is less that airbnb are asking negatively (although i do take issue with that ) but much more that as a host i am not aware of having been notified that the survey has changed so that i know what i'm being judged on.  

Robin4
Level 10
Mount Barker, Australia

@Cari3....Oh come on Cari, when were you ever notified that Airbnb were making changes to their method of operation! You have been around long enough to know, it just doesn't happen.

We find out these things by trial and error. When it permits I now spend time with the guest and I am amazed what seasoned Airbnb users tell me of their experiences with Airbnb. Although another host has posted screen shots of what the new review process looks like from the guests perspective, my last guest is going to email me photos of each step and each page so I can get a better understanding of what we hosts are up against. He was genuinely shocked to see that this is what happens in the space of a month with just 3 four star reviews......Stats page 1and 1.png

 

This is where I was a month ago with a percentage rating of 98%!

This is where I am now with a percentage rating of 91%....all because of 3 four star reviews from guests who said they loved the experience and would return when the opportunity permitted!

Stats page 1.png

 

So Cari, yes things have been changed, and like the rest of us you have not been notified, and again yes your guest is now being prompted to judge you negatively. I value my Superhost just as you do yours and I will protect it in any way I can and if that means exposing the 'slight of hand' tactics that Airbnb are using in the review process.....then so be it!

Cheers....Rob

@Robin4 , I would really like to see the questionnaire, Rob, once you get it from the guest. Thank you.  You are talking about exposing such tactics, but really, what can we do about it? I'm afraid that as usual with new Airbnb changes in the platform, it comes down to take it or leave....

brings me to this thought: as we have also known and discussed for the last half a year or so, there have been less inquiries for a lot of properties. so, perhaps, Airbnb is actually trying to subtely edge out  properties and make them obsolete - short of delisting them, but then have "reasons" to delist them when the numbers are "too low". The effect would be so that the "desirable" listings (in their eyes) will get more/lots of bookings. like a property with a 30% occupancy rate is not as desirable as a property with a 90% occupancy rate because it takes up the same space and maintenace cost in the cyber space but brings in less profit.    Could be a logical conclusion, no?

Yet, at this point I still believe that it goes back to not having it thought through, just experimenting - and creating discontent among the truly responsible hosts- the old breed. i doubt newer hosts, or the ones who don't even manage their own properties  care  or even know about those details - it's just about the bottom line, the profit to be made......

Well, so here we are, not an  encouraging picture, is it...

Rob - how sad that we aren’t notified. I like to feel like a valued partner instead of just one piece of the airbnb machinery and frankly i think they owe it to us to notify us changes.  For me its about the common courtesy.   Our customers get to rate or communication to them so obviously airbnb know customers value that.    They’re very quick to ket us know about things needed like lockboxes for business travellers. So its not as if its difficult for them to do…and i believe its the very least we deserve. I didn't see the screenshots of the new survey - any chance you can tell me where to find them?  

 

Would any of you be prepared to sign an online petition if i set one up simply letting airbnb know how we'd like to be treated and communicated with?

 

The thing that interests me is that they clearly havent given much  thought to how it might harm airbnb if all of a sudden all their 5-star reviews stars start disappearing because like it or not, even though our prices are waaaay below those of hotels thats apparently the standard expected of us and they are our competition.  I’m sorry you've had those dropping ratings - i suppose i've been fortunate that i had mine snoozed for a while so am only now getting bookings and reviews.

 

sorry about the lack of caps...broken wrist only allows me to peck one-handed at the keyboard.
Kindly Cari

@Cari3 , I so agree with what you are saying re wanting to feel like a valued partner, and not just like one piece of the Airbnb machinery. Sadly, I am coming more and more to the conclusion that that is precicely what we are, simply the " product" that Airbnb is offering. I just finished reading the new book on Airbnb, "the Airbnb story", and that supports the idea of us hosts simply being an interchangeable commodity in their offering. The book was all about the business model and how it is evolving, a few horror host stories in there at the beginning, but nothing about a relationship between Airbnb and their hosts, though apparently Chesky still talks about Airbnb as fostering the idea of " belonging".

After digesting @Robin4 's info on how the questionnaire to the guests has changed, most likely negatively impacting hosts, and perhaps designed to actually do just that, the following analysis comes to mind:

so we all have followed and witnessed the numerous questions here in the last half year or so about less booking inquiries all across the board, greatly worrying some hosts. Maybe that indicates an oversupply of listings, and Airbnb is in the process of subtely reshapings the available listings by weeding out some "undesirable" ones, which are the ones that get lower ratings and that can be thrown out by them once they are down to 3 stars? Encouraging guests to be more critical will accomplish just that without directly confronting hosts.... Far fetched, but a possible scenario!

Also, purely from a profit angle, any listing that has a 10-30% booking rate  costs them as much in cyberspace listing and support as a listing that has a 90% booking rate - so which ones are they more interested in supporting and  promoting? It's the "busy ones", with lock box, "business ready" (meaning 24 hour check in) that they are pushing to the forefront.

 I just realized that in my local listings, they mostly show first the ones with the most reviews, intestingly enough no distinction between IB bookings and the ones that need to be requested, so I find my listing only on the second page (solid 5 stars all across the board)- and not showing up as a comparable when clicking on a similar listing. So it seems obvious that the old Airbnb idea of personalised service and care is getting drastically revamped in favor of mass bookings: IB, hardly any profile description any moreby hosts or guests, often only abstract images even as profile pic all points that way...

I'm just watching it all...not much hope we have any leverage with petitions, etc... 

 

Tina80
Level 4
Treasure Island, FL

Happening to me right now. Near perfect five star reviews, now nothing but nitpicking and unreasonable request, like heating a 18500 gallon pool in FLORIDA. when our listing doesnt state its heated. I am not going to sweat my superhost status anymore, the 100 a year credit is not worth being upset with lovely guest who dont know a 4 star review is bad bad bad for us host. 

Louise0
Level 10
New South Wales, Australia

Yes, the new review prompts are not helpful at all.  A good questionnaire should be neutral, skewed neither to the negative or positive.  I've had recent guests who've commented that they felt bad for me when they received the review prompts as they felt it was 'pushing' them to find fault where none existed.  All who have commented have made the observation that it felt far too intrusive and oddly 'anti-host'.