Gender and Age Discrimination? Host Using Scare Tactic to get me to Cancel

[Alex1383]

Hello Airbnb community!

First I want to say, this is my first time posting on these forums. And this may be somewhat of a long post. I apologize in advance, but I am really looking for some sort of help/advice. I know that younger guests are a touchy subject within the Airbnb community and I am 23. Not 16, or 18.... but 23. I'm a college grad with a full time job, paid off car, my own place, and a normal, respectable, human being. Probably act more like a 30 year old than an 18 year old.

I applied to reserve a place on Sept. 1 in the Rocky Mountains for myself and a group of friends to go skiing over New Years (28th-1st.) After applying, the host accepted my reservation request (NOT instant book), I was charged for the payment, and I reached out to the host, saying thank you for the opportunity and that we are looking forward to staying at their place. I did not get a response back for 10 weeks. Then, 6 weeks before our visit, the host sent me a 3 paragraph message, stating that we are not welcome to stay at their place. They say that because we are a "group of 10+ guys in our early 20's" that we will throw a party, cause damage to the property, and potentially create issues for the neighbors, and end up having the HOA call the police and fine the homeowner. She told me that she wasn't paying attention to my booking request when first applying and would have rejected me immediately if she noticed the circumstances. Again, this is less than two months away from our reservation, now that 99% of spots are booked and whatever is left costs $2500+ a night.

Background:

 - My group is 10 people. Not 50. Not 20. The posting has 5 beds and holds 10 people.

-  My group consists of people ages 22 to 25.

- My group is not all guys. It consists of men and women. 

- I have only used Airbnb 3 times. I have 3 perfect reviews. "Respectful, clean, would recommend" are some of the words hosts have used to describe me.

- No...we are not throwing a party. We just need a cheap place to stay during our ski trip.

- Who celebrates New Years with a party in a stranger's home? Was never even a thought. We will be spending time at the mountain villages and local bars like normal people.

My host then says that she will not cancel the booking (she probably doesn't know that I know that if she does so, she won't be able to rebook someone else) but that my group has to find another place to stay and cancel our reservation with her by December 14th in order to get our refund. She then says that if we DON'T find another place and simply show up to this location, they will refuse us entry, meaning we will be literally stranded 700 miles from home. 

It might seem pretty harmless compared to other forms of discrimination, but regardless of that, doesn't her reasoning for refusing us entry fall under age and gender discrimination? I read her entire post. We will be following the rules. There was no additional age requirement. And if we were all "guys" like she assumed, then that automatically means we will damage her property, in her eyes.

Instead of replying, I first went straight to Airbnb support to find out what my options are. They reached out to the host many times for over a week with no response. She finally responds, saying that we can only stay there if we agree to pay an extra $50 per person per night, for 6 "extra" guests due to a pricing error. An extra $1200. If it was a pricing error, she could have informed me the NEXT DAY after accepting my reservation and we could have worked something out like civil adults. This sort of confirms my guess that she was trying to scare me into cancelling so she could rebook another party at a higher rate. But since I called her bluff, she is trying to pass that higher rate to me and my guests. My case manager stated that if we don't agree to these terms, our reservation will be cancelled, the host will have the standard penalties, and they will help us with rebooking. But everywhere I've looked, Airbnb only refunds the original purchase and provides an extra 10-20% to help find another place. This won't even come close to getting us another place. (I've looked everywhere.)

At this point, I'm just unsure of what to do. I specifically booked this place because of the price. For an extra $1200, 3 months ago I could've booked a nicer place in a better area. My group and I have spent thousands on ski passes and equipment, taken time off work, and passed on other New Year's plans all for this trip. This trip is now a month away. Am I incorrect in believing she threatened me and used discrimination in her message? It is stated very clearly in Airbnb's policy that you cannot reject a guest based on gender and age, and her message mentioned both. It is my understanding that because of this, I could potentially take legal action to cover the expenses that have come with this trip if it comes to that. I should mention that I still have yet to reach out to the host directly since she sent her first message. I'm unsure if I should try to talk to her and show her that we are simply needing a place to stay and we are respectful. I just thought that having Airbnb support as a mediator would help diffuse the situation a bit, but that has proven unsuccessful.

Thank you so much in advance for any insight. 

[Alex1383]

Thank you for your input Sarah, I definitely understand that us young ones are not always what we claim to be... I know that I could think of many people in my age bracket who act with no consequence in mind and it makes things much more difficult for the average, well behaved individuals! But stereotyping is a dangerous game.

One thing that everyone is agreeance with; my host has been unprofessional and awful to work with. It really is a shame. It's people like this that hurt the entire community (as well as guests that trash places and bring additional uninvited guests.) I just wish this could have happened a week after my booking, not 10 or 12... Looking back, maybe I should've opened up to my host more, whether she responded or not. I'm not exactly a seasoned Airbnb user but know the ins and outs, and could have provided a friendly push towards her by doing exactly what you mentioned, sending some messages to put her mind at ease. But that opportunity may have passed by now. 

At the very least I hope Airbnb takes measures to ensure her hosting privileges are suspended if not removed entirely to prevent issues in the future. Hoenstly, I'm not sure why you would list a place for 10 people when grouchy neighbors, police encounters, and HOA fines are possibilities. Not exactly an ideal vacation spot no matter who the guest is. But maybe that's just me...

[Salem2]

@Alex1383

It’s unfortunate that the host reacted in such a hostile way, it seems like she panicked and as a result has put you in an uncomfortable position.

People don’t usually admit their mistakes but have you tried reaching out directly?  maybe you can reassure her the place is in good hands.

If she is still unwilling I would let it go, you don’t want to be there if you are not welcome or are unfairly charged extra money, take your business to hosts who appreciate it.

[Alice-and-Jeff0]

Am I the only person who is concerned that this property has an HOA which may get involved?  Doesn't that sound like they are not allowed to be hosting in their community?  Does it bother anyone that the host threatened that the neighbors might get involved?  That sounds threatening too.  And what's with the arbitrary Dec. 14 cut off?!  And the sudden increase in price once Airbnb Customer Service got involved?! WTH?!  Why would the CS Rep even talk about this with the guest - it's completely insane and against the TOS to EXTORT money from guests (which is what that it is - you can stay but only if you pay more to do so.... um, NO).  The host needs to cancel if they don't want to host this group and should have already done so.  Period. EOS. 

@Alex1383 - I would get a higher-up involved instead of the CS Rep you talked to already.  Ask for a manager.  While they can't make the host take you as clients, they most certainly can get the host kicked off the platform as well as work harder to help you find another property.   Frankly, I'd like to see how Airbnb thought they were going to achieve receiving an additional $1200 from you to make this reservation work because it is against so many policies my head is spinning.  I wouldn't bother with the host - there are so many red flags here that staying there is only going to be a mistake for you and your friends and likely ruin your vacation.  While you are searching, use other sites like HomeAway and ask Airbnb to look at their options for the local boutique hotels in the area that might have 5 rooms instead of a whole house  or a couple of suites that might fit your budget (since you said you planned on being out and about, not really needing a home during the vacation).  

[Alex1383]

I had not even considered the comment about the HOA involvement! Of course that's just an assumption, but a very plausible one.... and yes, once again the host has dug herself even DEEPER with the extortion comment. And the airbnb rep has put himself liable as well for actually relaying that ultimatum to me instead of telling the host right away that she is not allowed to do that. Also, the December 14th cutoff was simply because that is the 2 week mark before our reservation. Therefore we wouldn't have gotten a full refund if canceled after that date. I should've explained that better! Thank you for your time. I posted a larger update below if you care to read.

[Ange2]

@Alex1383       I suggest you keep on at Airbnb, the host has been irresponsible and unprofessional as has the Airbnb employee who  is demanding acceptance of terms that are contrary to Airbnb's own rules.   I know many hosts are leery of young people, especially groups of young people, but in my experience age does not matter,  people can be irresponsible at any age.

I would push Airbnb to pay the difference whether for this listing or another,  (and if another to block the dates on this one),  it made the error, and I also agree that the host should be penalized. Good luck!

[Gordon0]

It's time to up the ante with Airbnb CS. 
You've been treated terribly by this host and something needs to be done. 
Good luck, and please let us know the outcome. 

[Rebecca0]

I'm just adding my voice here in agreement with all who say you have been treated appallingly.  There is simply no excuse whatsoever for this host's behaviour.  I can only imagine how stressful it must be when your whole party has made plans, booked flights, bought ski passes etc.   

You MUST escalate your case with Airbnb!!

You ask about contacting the host.  I think it could be a good idea, as long as you keep it calm and professional (unlike her...).   Maybe try calling her?  

[Helen56]

@Alex1383You could try copy/pasting this entire thread in the host's airbnb message box!  Also send it to CS.  You sound like a very nice and responsible young man.  Good luck!!

[Alex1383]

@Helen56 @Rebecca0 @Gordon0 @Ange2 @Salem2 Thank you very much for the kind words, suggestions, and support. Makes me see that I'm not crazy in thinking that this should be resolved to SOME extent. I've been in contact with my THIRD case manager now.

UPDATE:

This just keeps getting more ridiculous. I can't remember the last time I felt more defeated. I feel like I am the only party involved who has done absolutely nothing wrong, yet the only one being punished. The third case manager was so far the most understanding. Not only with the situation, but with how the other managers have handled the situation thus far. 

First, he confirmed that the increased pricing ultimatum made by the host was not fair and was very surprised that the other manager even relayed that option to me in the first place. Secondly, he was concerned at the fact that this has escalated into multiple issues and it sounds like each issue will be looked at seperately. First, the discrimination, secondly, the lack of action by the other manager, and third, the extortion threat itself of not being able to stay there if I don't pay more. 

The manager has gotten the Trust and Safety team involved to review the host's actions, I have not heard any updates on this part as of yet. 

The manager explained how he and his team will be reaching out to all remaining hosts in the area and attempt to come to an agreement on a discounted price for my group. But I don't think anyone can be persuasive enough to turn a $6000+ rental into a $2000 one. He went ahead and canceled my reservation with the host and a refund was issued. Things started to look up and I finally felt like I was getting some REAL support. But now a day later, that feeling is wearing off. I looked at the original host's posting and airbnb has NOT EVEN BLACKLISTED THE DATES. The host has already rebooked someone for 2 of the 4 days we had booked. Unbelievable. I asked the manager about this and have yet to receive a response. The cancellation has not even triggered the automated review that states the host cancelled a reservation. (Also, the host cancelled someone's November booking 5 days before the guest was scheduled to arrive. It almost makes me wonder if a similar situation occured over Thanksgiving break....?)

My manager touched base with me last night saying, "I am still checking and reaching out to other host in the hopes of getting a much ideal price range. I may not be able to promise anything yet but know for you sure that I will continue to help you on this matter." If he cannot promise me anything, I am going to have him get me in contact with someone who can. They keep telling me how frustrated we must be and they are truly sorry for the situation. I appreciate the empathy but I don't need empathy, I just need results at this point. Again, this isn't a situation of just having to change vacation plans. We are talking thousands of dollars on the line. At least $2000 in ski passes and another $1500+ in new gear. I was even in the middle of closing a deal on buying a used SUV that I've had to back out of because we didn't want to borrow or rent for a 1500 mile trip. (Because despite what the host stereotyped my group as, we are RESPONSIBLE and didn't want someone else to have to worry about the wear and tear a trip to the mountains with a car full of people and gear can do to a vehicle.)

As a solution from airbnb is beginning to look more and more unlikely, I am starting to weigh my options from a legal perspective. I'm worried that I may not even be able to take my host to small claims to pay for the expenses related to this trip and her illegal actions, due to being in different states. But I will cross that bridge when I get there.

[John1080]

@Alex1383, not being able to do anything right at the moment with the host, I would try to at least find something that you can rent - even just some motel rooms. You may have said, but which ski resort/area is it that you have passes? You may have to end up driving a bit, but at least you would still get to go and would not waste the rest of the money you've invested.  I can try to give you some info on distances, roads to take, towns that would be manageable to and from the resort(s) you're planning to visit.  

[Ange2]

@Alex1383    "NOT EVEN BLACKLISTED THE DATES",   unfortunately when Airbnb cancel a reservation the dates are not blocked out and there are no penalties.  The host has to push the cancellation button for that to happen.  Best would have been for the CS support you spoke to, to tell the host to honor the booking or cancel it themself that way penalties would have been applied and the dates would have been blocked. The problem with Airbnb is everything is automated. Airbnb support claim they cannot manually override the automation, thus problems, errors, mistakes cannot be individually addressed, resolved or put to right. It takes the intervention of Airbnb, outside the automated system, to correct its mistake.  I would still push hard for Airbnb to pay the difference of the price of a new booking, and especially as it allowed the host to rebook the dates after breaking Airbnb's rules and the contract it had with you re: honoring a confirmed booking.  Some say using twitter or FB can make Airbnb sit up,  listen, and do the right thing. Again, good luck!

[Alex1383]

Makes sense, Thank you for the explanation! The manager's exact words, "I told her that I will speak to guest if they agree else we will cancel the reservation with host penalties."

Looks like another thing that is now not being honored!

[Mark116]

What a mess! What should have happened, as far as I can tell is that

1) the host honors your reservation at the agreed upon price.  The End. 

2) the host cancels your reservation and takes the penalty hit, which leaves you needing a new place to stay. 

The fact that 3) airbnb cancels the reservation before they have found anywhere to rehouse you and so not only does the host have no penalty but you have no housing is pretty nutty, but not that surprising.  I expect that the host will get dinged on the age discrimination, but it doesn't seem that this will affect their ability to rebook those dates at a higher rate and airbnb can't guarantee to find you a comparable place at the same price.

My guess is that since you went to airbnb to resolve this and even though they have done a poor job of it, it may foreclose the option of small claims court, especially since it appears it was airbnb that cancelled and not the host, you might look at going to airbnb arbitration if they can't find you similar accommodations when all is said and done.

[Helen3]

@Alex1383 yes it is appalling that Airbnb have not at least suspended the hosts listing if not cancelled it. However what you don't seem to have grasped is that Airbnb is just a listing company and the T&Cs you signed up to means legal action against them is unlikely to succeed. 

No-one at Airbnb can promise you to make a 6000 listing availabe for 2000.

Why not focus your energies on finding alternative accommdation.

Look at other listings Airbnb does allow hosts to have over 21 or over 25 year old rules. Airbnb does not have anythin in it's anti discrimination policy regarding age discriminaton unless it is prohibited by law in an area.

Read through their diversity policy age isn't mentioned.

[John1080]

@Helen3, my thoughts exactly. It's too bad this has happened and the host is terrible for having done it, but at this point, in order to salvage the trip, I'd be focusing on what I can do to assure my trip works out. A very unfair lesson that life isn't fair.