Think Twice Before Starting with Airbnb

[Carie1]

Beware.

Once you start with Airbnb, it is hard to leave. If you have a high rating, it will cost a lot to establish with a different platform and rebuild. So, my advice: don't do it. Don't start with Airbnb.

In general, as you will see if you cruise the community forum, Airbnb is not host oriented. They don't have your back. And in some ways their system is beyond parasitic and into abusive, for several reasons, aside from general human fluffupery:

1. As with ride-sharing, Amazon and other online ventures, the first step for the dominant online provider is to put brick-and-mortar companies out of business by making prices very low. This doesn't just give them greater leverage over the consumer, but it also shifts the workforce from an organized one to a diffuse, un-unionized, screwable population. If you join Airbnb you will be as valued and cherished as an Uber driver. Don't think 'Airbnb gets a cut of my take, so surely the more money I make the more money they make.' Think 'Airbnb is in the phase of crushing hotels, and to do that they need to crush their hosts, too.' In every way they can, Airbnb will try to push your prices down. (You can say 'I won't rely on their suggested price,' --don't!--but in the leaner times their suggested prices become a self-fulfilling prophecy.)

2. Time is money. If you get in a problem where a drunken guest takes your jade lamp and tries to impale someone else, meanwhile leaving several large holes in your kitchen wall--just saying--and you hope Airbnb will refund you in a timely manner--No. Maybe you'll expect a stall, because every day they delay is more money for them and less for you. You can expect to be dicked around (depreciating the value of the jade lamp because... jade fades? Rather than using replacement value). But really no matter how hard you try to prepare yourself, you can have no idea how crushingly horrible, inconvenient and deliberately dehumanizing the 'resolution' process is. (And my host isn't even disputing!)  So here are things to think about:

- of course there is the full-time job of tracking your things and their condition, keeping receipts, etc

- in your disaster planning, realize that you can't count on Airbnb to pay for repairs in a timely manner, and this could mean YOU WILL BE SHUT DOWN so that while you are sitting in your drafty kitchen, you will not only be frustrated as heck but you will also have lost your income for an indeterminate amount of time. My damages were over $7,000. I can't float that. Could you?

- Imagine the worst, most unresponsive, most 'riddled by rules and ruled by riddles' federal bureaucracy and then multiply that by 10. There are three separate departments, one for extra cleaning costs, one for repairs and one for broken rules. And they don't talk to each other. (Why should they? Delay is good for them.) So budget your time for this morass--and I include their wretched resolution platform in this! It is a bottomless well.

- The delay is a feature, not a bug. I resisted the conclusion that the de-humanizing is also a feature, a deliberate  pattern, but actually I am happier now that I admit the obvious. They really could not accidentally be so horrible. I felt like Charlie trying to just at least touch the football... For example in the now 10 weeks since the hole-bashing event, I have not received one call from my case manager, but I have repeatedly been getting little teases 'send me your telephone number' (because Airbnb doesn't have my number?) I respond. But of course, no call. You can't do crap like that 4 times and have it be an accident.

- And this is not a lower-level staff issue. This is a management issue. It seems likely it is being managed exactly the way Airbnb wants it to be managed.

If you do decide to do Airbnb despite this warning, my other advice is: keep your sense of humor. They really do have the power to exert considerable practical harm, but if you can laugh at them at least it doesn't have to go soul-deep. They won't have your back. They are not well-intentioned towards you. To expect that is a recipe for misery. Plan accordingly.

Good luck--

Carie

[Sarah977]

@Carie1  What one has to lose in trying to get Airbnb to pay up for damages is one's time. For a big claim, it might be worth pursuing, although from what I read, it's easier to get them to pay out smaller amounts. 

You also have to consider your frustration and stress tolerance, which can take a toll on your general well being. If a host can simply view it as part of the day's business, i.e. "Okay, time to call Airbnb for zillionth time", sure, keep insisting they do the right thing, but if it's an emotional stressor, having your own damage fund, getting on quickly with repair and replacement, would seem preferable.

[Mark116]

@Sarah977  That's true, and basically why we've never made a damage claim. 

But it is an ugly, ugly dynamic that Airbnb makes something that should be pretty basic-- X damaged Y and here is the overwhelming evidence=pay-out--into something out of Dante's Inferno.  There would be no Airbnb at all if hosts the world over were not trustworthy, did not provide accurate and clean listings as well as hospitality.  Airbnb doesn't do that, hosts do it, if anything Airbnb's crazy ever changing rules get in the way of good hosting.  To  then get thrown into the proverbial pit of hell when trying to claw back money that you are legitimately owed, it stings and is wrong, and yes, it is a form of grooming.

[Carie1]

That is  very wise, @Sarah977 .

I am going to monitor my 'is this fun yet?' meter. If I am taking a rest and knitting and I can make the next call in a spirit of constructiveness (not false hope, but 'constructive' could be the whole range from cheerful pokery to keeping a clear record) and also get a few rows done on my daughter's winter scarf--well then yes! And if i am getting into a knot of frustration--no no no. Let that go. (No, I was not there a month ago. I was really stressed and it was immensely time-consuming.)

A teacher a long time ago talked about how we can collude in our own damage, and that is ringing in my ears, too. I am still resisting the idea of agreeing to the grooming. As I hear all these other stories, I see being trained to not ask for the promised stuff as a form of grooming. But it is also a form of realism, another layer. Where, in that reality, lies the happiest and easiest and most ethical path? Or the most powerful? Or, wait, I mean the least powerless, in this context.  ; - )

[Sarah977]

@Carie1  I also agree with not just letting Airbnb get away with washing their hands of damages done by guests. If they aren't going to take responsibilty for properly vetting the guests they allow on the platform, not boot those who receive bad reviews, nor take a real security deposit from guests, then they need to step up to the plate.

Their methods of making it as time-consuming and frustrating an experience as possible, in hopes a host will just give up, is definitely not okay.

I would certainly pursue such things with them, but as I said, as a business chore that I don't lose sleep over. If a host doesn't have that ability to compartmentalize, and not get emotionally distraught, it's probably better for them to go a different route to cover themselves if bad guests trash the place.

[Robin4]

@Carie1 

Carie, there are enough unknowns in hosting, and every guest teaches you something.

Don't get me wrong, I love hosting and have had a wonderful lot of guests over the past 6 years but, one way or another some of them will tax you.

Just last week Ade had to fish a condom out of the toilet, it had an air pocket and would not flush. No big deal but, that is a gross thing to leave behind for someone else to deal with.

I have breakages to deal with, I am on my third TV remote control for the current cottage TV. The floor is polished concrete, the guest drops the remote....and surprise, it doesn't work any more. Same with the shower screen, the guest takes the remote off the wall and puts it in the soap holder, it gets wet and doesn't work any more. I tell them not to, just leave on the wall where it is, it works just fine, just press the up icon and it goes up, the down icon and it goes down, simple....... but the odd guest won't take any notice.

The countertop gets cut into, frypans scratched, plates and glasses broken, towels and linens bleached with nail polish remover or acne cream.....welcome to hosting.

Carie I host an average of 11-12 guests a month, many of them one nighters, each  on top of another. Going through the resolution process is just plain soul destroying!

You have to lodge a claim within a certain number of hours....or before the next guest arrives.

The guest has a certain number of hours to respond to the hosts claim. In most instances they will reject it.

The resolution centre then becomes involved and assesses firstly if the guest is responsible or the host negligent.

Any compensation could be as little as 10% of the value of the damage claim.

And if the damage is likely to impact on future reservations you have to mock up some temporary repair and just sit and wait for some sort of outcome.

Why on earth would you put yourself through that Carie? It just makes no sense.

In most of these instances it was an accident, some guests will offer to pay, some won't, but whatever, I just pull the money out of the damage fund and a few hours later I am back in the business of hosting. I don't hassle the guest or Airbnb, I get good reviews and it works. 

Some will say I am condoning poor behaviour but, I will call them out privately and report them if they deserve it, I have done that twice. Hopefully that makes them lift their game for next time!

That is why I don't attempt to claim from Airbnb. I am 77 and need all the sanity around me I can get! I do not need to be jerked around by company officialdom whos soul desire is to limit their compo exposure!

Cheers........Rob

[Caroline2213]

I totally agree.  Nothing is perfect.  Airbnb has given our real estate company a great opportunity.   We have taken rentals that we had to totally remodel.  I have 5 star reviews communicate with my guests and they to me.  Sometimes a just get a feeling about someone but if the guest broke something oh well....if it is that serious and they don't own up to it....then a bad review will suffice. 

I love hosting.  I love the autonomy....and creating a comfortable and unique place for guests to enjoy.    

Wow.   

[Carie1]

Gaslighting?

[Ann72]

@Carie1  I agree with "why not do both?"  Yes, my pricing takes the unexpected into account, but because the resolution center is there, I don't see why I shouldn't use it.  I have put in 4 small claims and been reimbursed 4 times with absolutely no fuss at all.  Therefore I know I would feel as you do right now if I were to go in with a claim and get the kind of runaround you're getting.  It's unconscionable.

[Elaine701]

@Ann72 

Yes, of course you can "do both". My experience is that once they turn you down, CS will just refuse any further discussion about it. So, it's probably going to be  short lived exercise anyway. 

But.. Be wise... Once you alert Airbnb, you also alert the guest. And that's just begging for a fabricated retaliatory review, which can be rather damaging. So, either wait until the guest has written their review, or suffer the risk of retaliation. 

For large damages, it's probably less important to consider retaliatory reviews, but then, you're unlikely to get compensation anyway, so again, carefully consider your options. 

My approach is just to do everything to avoid this type of guest in the first place. It's no guarantee, but looking carefully at who's booking and scaring them away if it seems dubious has very likely saved me on a number of occasions. 

I can cite at least two situations where the guest violated house rules, had more people staying than booked, and caused minor damage... But I didn't confront them, nor contact Airbnb.

In both cases, we received 5 star reviews from the guest. I of course, wrote the truth in my review of the guest, which resulted in a scathing totally fabricated (private) responses complete with a long list of imaginary horrors they experienced at our place. 

Had I confronted them before they wrote their reviews, those private responses surely would have been the essence of their reviews. And it's doubtful that I would have received any relief from Airbnb anyway. So, what's the point? The confrontation is more damaging than the guest. 

IMO, it's just being realistic. And now, I'm even more careful to ask questions before they book, and scare them away when I don't like their responses. And so far, it's working. 

[Colleen253]

@Elaine701 This comment is everything. Especially about problematic guest avoidance. It begins there. It’s all about working smarter, not harder. 

[Elaine701]

Thanks, @Colleen253 

If I recall, I believe it may have been you who originally taught me that prevention is the best cure. It's my whole MO now. You've probably saved me a bundle of money & frustration. 

My sincerest regards 🙂

[Carie1]

And I love the 'scare them away when I don't like their responses' phrase. 😉

[Laura2592]

@Carie1 I would 100% take this to social media. This seems to be the only way anyone gets any action. Tweet, tag on Instagram and Facebook, do a TikTok video, whatever it takes. And for the love of all that's holy,  I hope you left these guests an honest review!

[Carie1]

Oh I had fun with the review! But really, the person on the hook was just an idiot in a tough situation that got out of hand. I have been that person.

As for the social media... hmmmm.... Hollywood Movie. But who would play me? No, who would play my love interest?

BTW, I found the jade lamp in a dresser drawer. THAT was funny. ("Maybe Mom won't notice?")

[Laura2592]

@Carie1 I think casting should begin right away! I keep being told to write a book about some of my hosting experiences so I'll interview you when I shop it around Hollywood 😉