Should Guest be Expected to Clean when Host Charges a Cleaning Fee?

[Rob183]

Hi there, 

Curious on this one as a guest and a host.   My wife/friendsand I have been on opposite sides of the argument both as hosts and guests.

If a host charges a guest a cleaning fee (not small at $200 here in SF), what is the cleaning expectation of guests?

Some in our circles have argued guests should do the dishes and leave the place tidy.  Others have argued their paying a sizeable cleaning fee so why should they have to clean.

Curious what the community thinks and if there is a clear answer or it depends.

Thanks in Advance!

[Ashley1313]

@Helen3 I think I covered the understanding that I have on the cost for providing a service. I also think I made clear that if you require a cleaning fee then there should not be a guest cleaning. 15 minutes out of any guests stay for stripping the beds, washing dishes, and emptying garbage cans is too much time. Even if it was 5 minutes, its not the point of how much time it takes. Its the point of a guest not having to clean when they paid for a cleaning service to be done after they depart. 

That is my point and that point will stand. You may feel differently and that is your right. As a guest, I am giving my opinion on where it is I choose to stay according to the rules set in each space. And I am not the only person who feels that way that stays within spaces on Airbnb. 

[Sarah977]

@Ashley1313  So what you seem to be saying is that the extra 15 minutes that it would take you to tidy up and wash your breakfast dishes is something you would be happy to pay for? Or do you think that an extra 15 minutes of a cleaner's time comes free of charge? 

Most Airbnbs have some expectation that the guest spends 10 or 15 minutes cleaning up their personal mess. If you prefer the hotel model, where you can just  walk away leaving whatever mess you like for the underpaid, overworked, usually immigrant  cleaner to deal with, then you should book hotels, not expect Airbnb hosts to cater to your "I'm on holiday so I shouldn''t have to lift a finger" attitude.

If you want to have a comfortable flight with extra service, you book business or first class with a major airline. You don't book an economy seat on budget airline and then complain that the seats are too close together and there's no free cocktails.

If you can find hotels where you get the same amenities, amount of space, and privacy for the same price as an Airbnb, by all means go for it. People generally book Airbnbs over hotels because they can get more bang for their buck. 

[Ashley1313]

@Sarah977  I think its not a care in the world of mine if it does take your cleaner 15 minutes to do it. If I'm paying a cleaning fee then I could care less who you get to clean it. I just know that it should not be your guest during they're paid and cleaning fee covered stay. That's not my issue because it is not my space. **

Also, I don't know where you live, but there are American people working at hotels as well and hotels provide jobs for people to feed their families. If you feel a particular way about that, then you can hire those same people at a more reasonable wage to take care of your space. Don't throw around the idea that people who stay at hotels are feeding into an organization of overworked and underpaid people. Because staying at those hotels keep food on their tables. 

I stay at hotels and Airbnb's (hotels much more so) that cater to the money I'm spending, and as long as I'm not staying in your space, it's none of your business how or whether I "lift my finger". If you're referring to your Airbnb as "an economy seat" then I may be inclined to agree. However, there are Airbnb's well worth the high price, and even lower priced ones that too are very much well worth it. Its not about the price, its about the service. Remember that! Telling someone that breakfast is included in the total cost and then telling them they have to cook it, is about service. People don't mind breakfast included... Common sense already implies that included should mean its already made, otherwise why state it. Just like a cleaning fee within those with common sense would imply that you DON'T HAVE TO CLEAN. The total cost isn't the argument, and neither was whether I had a problem with it. But you still seem to be missing the point.

So on that note, this is taking way too much of my time to entertain. No one after this will get a reply. I've made my point, I've stated my opinion, which is my God given right. **

-take care

** [Inappropriate content removed in line with the Community Center Guidelines]

[Sarah977]

@Ashley1313  I don't have a cleaner, I do the cleaning myself. I get responsible, respectful guests who leave their space clean and tidy. And have no complaints.

My business plan and finances are just fine.

[Gillian166]

leave it @Sarah977 . This person is not a host, and people who swan in with opinions and then accuse any respondees as being argumentative, and then dramatically flounce out of the forums (with a sweetly crafted insult no less) should be left to flounce out with style.  

[Ashley1313]

I have 2 properties going up this year sweetheart, so should really know what you're talking about before you decide to speak upon it. & last time I checked, this thread said "should guest", that warrants my opinion.  @Gillian166 

[Gillian166]

@Ashley1313 
I was more commenting on you giving hosts advice when you aren't a host, how am I to know what your future plans are? All the best with your 2 properties going up this year. (Most hosts would have posted this in the host-only board)

I actually agree with you sweetheart, I don't think guests need to clean, I don't even like the way ABB set up this system so we add on that as a fee, but it is what it is. You might soon discover that there are different levels of 'clean'. A sink full of food-crusted unwashed dishes is just downright rude IMHO, and you'll find your cleaning service (or yourself if you are managing some of the cleaning yourself) will not appreciate the extra 30mins you have to spend on that. 

 I think most people are trained to tidy up when they leave. Outside of a hotel room, any time you rent a place (on any platform) that has a kitchen it's always in the check out instructions to wash and put away all dishes. I only ask my guests to put dishes in the dw, and turn it on (I need to add that step in which is funny), we are happy to put them away. 

[Mike-And-Jane0]

@Ashley1313 Only a half dozen posts higher up on this thread you said

'So on that note, this is taking way too much of my time to entertain. No one after this will get a reply. I've made my point, I've stated my opinion, which is my God given right. **

-take care'

and yet you are now replying. 

Obviously you can change your mind but I did find it a little amusing.

[Ashley1313]

and I said nothing regarding the topic of conversation as I said I wouldn't. -Thanks @Mike-And-Jane0 

[Gillian166]

I tell my guests they don't have to strip the beds, in fact i prefer they don't, easier to spot stains when the sheets are still on the beds. I do ask them to take any food/drinks with them, and put the dw on, but lately i've had a run of guests handwashing instead, which is gross, because they do a terrible job of it and we have to go through the cupboards checking everything. I get it, maybe they only used 6 items and don't want to run the dw. frankly, i'd rather do a 15min dw run on 6 items than have to go through the cupboard and inspect every single item for cleanliness (tip: check the stuff at the back in case they hid chipped items back there). I ask them to disclose chipped or broken items, it happens, we aren't going to punish anyone. 

As much as I don't like the cleaning fee, in a way it's also our insurance policy for the time a guest damages something, like the time a guest stained a doona cover, (she stripped the bed for me completely, including the doona cover, so i knew something was up), and i couldn't get it clean after 3 soaks, (she ghosted me in messaging), so had to buy a new one. Well, that's what the cleaning fee subsidies, the stained rug, the broken glass, the broken chair.....  

Personally i'd be happy to do away with it and level the playing field, but it is what it is. 

[Emilie]

Hi @Ashley1313 and everyone,

I appreciate you feel strongly about this matter, but I would like to ask you to please refrain from making personal comments towards other members of the Community Center. In order for this space to remain constructive, we ask everyone to be respectful and keep our Community Guidelines in mind. 

You might find this article interesting as well, as it explains what is expected of guests using the platform. Every Host is free to set their own price based on a variety of factors at play, and every guest can select the property that best matches their needs and budget. 

Thanks, 

Emilie

[Ashley1313]

@Emilie I will absolutely always speak a certain way if I'm being spoken to a certain way. I would like to hope that you aren't singling out my comments with prejudice, as everyone in this forum that did have something to say to my response, made those comments personally. I know we have all heard the saying that you have to give respect to receive it. So I hope everyone involved is tagged and not just myself, seeing as I wasn't going back and forth in discussion alone.

[Robin4]

@Ashley1313 

I know your comments are a few months old and maybe you have moved on now, but if you do still visit the Community Centre can I please just give a bit of clarification regarding a hosts cleaning fee........

No host expects a guest to prepare for the next reservation to arrive!

We don’t expect you to wipe down the walls, the counter-tops, attend to those coffee cup rings on the bedside and occasional tables, checking for insects and spider webs.

We don’t expect you to strip the bed and remove those blood, alcohol or makeup stains from the linens, put them through the washing machine, dry them and iron ready for a future guest.

We don’t expect you to wash the towels and provide new face-washers to replace those that were destroyed by nail polish remover, fake tan lotion and Acne cream.

We don’t expect you to remake the bed with fresh linens and put out a new set of towels and face washers.

We don’t expect you to vacuum the carpets, rugs and steam mop the floors.

We don’t expect you to clean the toilet, shower alcove, sinks and taps.

We don’t expect that you will wash, dry and put away the dishes, cutlery, saucepans and glassware that you have used.

We don’t expect you to restock the fridge with a cheese plate, milk, eggs and bacon, fruit juice, a beer and a cider and water from the re-stock facilities.

We don’t expect you to test that the TV, the fridge, the hot water, the DVD player, the air conditioning filter, the washing machine, the smoke alarm, the microwave and hotplate, the electric blankets are all working!

This is what we charge a cleaning fee for! To return the property to the state which you entered it in.

We just expect you will put your rubbish in the bin, pick up those used nappies and condoms that were left under the bed and dispose of and not leave the property looking like a pig sty.

Put furniture back the way you found it.

Leave the property in a relatively tidy state.

There are certain overheads that must be covered in order to provide a listing in the first place.

There is a property mortgage to be covered, insurances, council rates and permits, maintenance, breakages, gardening, electricity and gas, water the constant supply of condiments……..This is what you pay for in the listing amount.

It is most unfortunate that many guests do not seem to be able to differentiate between the two!!

The listing amount covers the cost of supplying the property. The cleaning fee covers the cost of continuing to offer it to guests!

Why is it legal?….because everyone in this world is entitled to a reward for their work….I don’t begrudge you yours, why would you begrudge me mine!

Cheers…..Rob

[Karol22]

In my opinion, no. But there's no excuse for a guest being a slob. From my perspective, guests are dealing with the logistics of their trip already in an area they haven't been to. They need to figure out how to get to an airport or their next destination as it is, so giving them a list of chores before they depart is simply bad form. No, I don't expect guests to 'clean their dishes' or 'take out the trash'... this is what guests pay for from the cleaning fee I request and I pay our cleaner to take care of such items. If this is aggravating to me, then simply raising the cleaning fee helps make the aggravation go away. But to be fair, there is no excuse for being a slob as a guest - those folks get dealt with in reviews.

[Gregory497]

As a renter, and mostly for longer stays, I found this thread interesting. I agree with @Gillian166 that putting dishes in the dishwasher makes so much sense! I’ve rarely received that request from renters but always do it.

But I also take issues when the cleaning fees are huge. I will sometimes rent a space that 4 people could accommodate but be there just myself and barely use any of the facilities but am still billed a fee as if I was a full house.

And when I stay long term I ask the owners to connect me to their cleaners so the place remains tidy throughout my stay and on my exit, but only once did a host refund me the cleaning fee because of that.

The way Airbnb does it as an add on makes it feel like a hidden fee. Hotels add their cleaning costs into the price of your stay and it would make sense to me if any costs the host incurs would just be woven into their rental price rather than an extra UNLESS extra cleaning was required.

And just this week, for the first time ever, I was accused of leaving a place I stayed at just long enough to sleep, as a “total mess” - which was completely crazy and Airbnb doesn’t allow you to post your response to the host’s lie. So, you pay rent, a cleaning fee, and then are rated without any means to defend yourself. 

99% of my experiences have been great but as Airbnb has expanded I feel there are more people who want to profit from renting their spaces without putting in the same effort as the hosts who turned this into such a great service.

If you think about it Airbnb is the largest hotel service in the world. They provide more rooms in more countries than any other hotel chain and they do it by allowing independent contractors to provide and prepare the rooms and most of the customer service while taking a hefty fee for connecting customers to said rooms and handling disputes/insurance etc. But Unlike a hotel they don’t cover the cost of any upkeep or cleaning  - clever model, and why their profits are enormous and growing!