Additional Guest - Additional charge or refuse?

[Mita127]

Hi everyone! First time post, long time lurker here 🙂 Sorry for the long post! (Previous posts about additional guests were mainly on entire properties rather than a room in my case. Some background: I have a 2 bed 2 bathroom flat, and I Airbnb out the second bedroom and bathroom - here's my link just in case: https://www.airbnb.co.uk/rooms/44039080?source_impression_id=p3_1660306101_B3KjtcL%2FiC4vlPkA The flat is spacious and the room is a double but since I also live here, I personally feel comfortable with just the one guest, which is on the listing i.e. the number of guests is limited to one and there's no option to add to this, and no additional guest charges. 

I have one guest staying with me for a month, he has been here for almost 12 days so he is about a third of the way through his month long stay. He is a recent graduate, and while he is polite and pleasant, he is somewhat "undomesticated" and has not paid attention to the house rules (e.g. cleaning after oneself in the kitchen, not using the shared areas after 10pm etc) which I believe is down to inexperience rather than intentional. He is new to Airbnb.

However, he has just asked me if his ex-flatmate from uni can crash with him in his room for one night and that he is coming over this afternoon! I felt a bit under pressure so I reluctantly agreed, he then said it would actually be 2 nights over the weekend (instead of one night) and that they would be out for the majority of the day so I wouldn't even know that they are there. Then he said a different friend needed a place to crash next week for 3 nights. I explained to him that extra guests is explicitly mentioned in the House Rules, and that Airbnb would not cover me for any issues arising from unregistered guests. There are also additional costs incurred from extra guests, e.g. water, a bit of electricity, possibly use of the kitchen appliances. I'm also a bit concerned that once I say yes, he will ask again to have guests for the remaining 18 days of his stay. Also all the hotels in the area appear to be booked out. So I am not sure what to do. Options are:

1) Simply say no to any additional guests including the one today

2) Say ok to the one coming today but no to any further guests

3) Say yes to the guests he has mentioned AND

4) Charge them for the nights that additional guests are staying, or not?

5) If charging, how much would you charge them per additional guest per night?

Your advice would be much appreciated! 

Thanks all! 

[Huma0]

@Mita127 

Your listing makes it very clear, both in the house rules and the description, that the room is for one person only and no extra guests are allowed, so I think you would be perfectly within your rights to politely remind the guest again that it's in the house rules which he agreed to when he booked and that sorry, no, you will not make any more exceptions.

If you do decide to allow it, then I think it is reasonable to ask for a fee for an extra person. You are not running a charity. Although, normally I would say you can't charge for something not mentioned on your listing, but seeing as you've clearly stated no extra guests, you need to present this as you are willing to make an exception, but only if you are reimbursed because it is not fair to expect strangers to use your home for free.

The problem is, when you make an exception to your house rules once, the guest is going to think you will make further exceptions, either to that particular rule or to others and it sounds like this guest is really NOT paying attention to your rules, so I would not encourage this. Personally, I would go the first route and politely, but firmly, tell him no. I would also ask him to have a re-read of the house rules. Sure, this could result in a bad review, but I don't think hosts should be held hostage to that, especially when you are sharing your own home.

In terms of going forward and preventing this in future, what do you do to ensure that guests read your rules and take them seriously? In my experience, most guests do not read the extended house rules or the full listing description, so you need to MAKE them do it. 

I will not accept a guest until they have confirmed in the airbnb messaging system that they have read the full listing, including the extended rules and agree to them. I will also highlight a couple of key points. These should be whatever you find to be regular issues/things that guests need to understand but might have missed. For me, this is usually that I have cats and the smoking policy and, depending on the room, stairs and traffic noise. 

Because a lot of guests say they have read the full rules when they actually haven't, I include an 'Easter egg' question in there that they need to answer in order to book.

This might all seem tedious or even heavy handed, but I have found it necessary, especially as I host long term guests in my own home. I'm not saying this totally prevents some guests from still breaking rules or complaining about stuff clearly mentioned on the listing, but it does reduce it significantly.

As for extra guests/visitors, I used to have a maximum of two people per room with a higher rate for two. However, like you, I now have a maximum of one person. In my rules, I say no unauthorised visitors and that visitors cannot stay overnight. However, I do allow guests to have an additional person stay for short periods if they ask in advance and there is a fee for this and that is stated in my rules too. So far, I am finding this works. I've only had one guest who seemed a bit put out about having to pay more for someone to stay over but she was a bargain hunter from the beginning. Everyone else has agreed and paid. 

If that seems too complicated, then just stick to your rule about no additional guests/ visitors, but then you need to be prepared to say no the first time a guest asks.

[Mita127]

Hi @Huma0  thank you so much for your reply! 

I do ask all guests during the booking process whether they have read the House Rules but often they will simply say "yes"  without actually reading them, which is quite frustrating. I like your Easter egg idea so I will also have to use this!

Do you ever have to verbally remind guests of the House Rules if they are repeatedly not following them? I really need to get over the awkwardness and just tell them lol. I think it's hard to not feel like you're patronising someone when telling them really basic life things, such as switching lights and appliances off when they leave the room, and to wash up the pots / pans and utensils after using them to cook. I do wonder about the state of previous accommodations! 

anyway, I will probably ask for a fee for the additional guest arriving today for the 2 nights (probably £25 a night or something) but I will definitely just say no to any more additional guests after this weekend, since my listing is already very clear about additional guests. 

Thanks again

[Huma0]

@Mita127 

You may find that once the guest has to pay for it, the need for their friends to stay over suddenly disappears! I prefer to make the extra charge via the Airbnb system as an additional fee so that the guest doesn't think it's anything dodgy. However, you need to be confident that the guest will actually accept the charge (Airbnb won't enforce it if they don't) so make sure they pay in advance of the friend staying over!

Yes, I do often have to verbally remind guests of house rules. I do quite a detailed welcome tour which includes some of those things, like turning off lights, washing dishes etc. I find this really helps. Even if you've asked the guest to re-read the rules right before their stay, there are things they will still forget. They are more likely to remember when they are reminded with a visual prompt, e.g. standing by the sink and showing them where the washing up liquid is when you remind them about washing up. You have to keep it friendly and informative, rather than a list of dos and don'ts.

There was one thing I didn't mention when showing my most recent guest around because she was tired after a long flight. Guess what? That's the one rule she is now breaking, i.e. she keeps leaving the lights on in her room when she goes out, even if she's going to be gone for hours. She's pretty wasteful of electricity and water in general. None of the other guests (who were reminded about it in the house tour) are doing that. So, I won't make that mistake again!

If a guest still breaks some rule or the other, yes I will remind them in a polite and friendly way. You don't have to make a big deal of it, unless it is indeed a big deal, e.g. they are doing something really out of order. As @Kelly149 says, keep it upbeat and confident.

If the guest still repeatedly does that thing, or several things, at some point I do become uncomfortable about reminding them as I do not want to be a nag . It's not my personality and guests are not going to like it. The last time I had to repeatedly remind a guest about leaving the kitchen clean, he left me 3* and marked me down on cleanliness!  In those cases, I usually just take a deep breath, look forward to check out day, mark the guest down accordingly in the ratings and block them from booking again.

[Richard531]

@Huma0  "You may find that once the guest has to pay for it, the need for their friends to stay over suddenly disappears!"

LOL!  You the nail as squarely on the head as you can hit it. And this really gave me a good yuck too.  Well done!  

So this begs the question: why are we beating around the bush?  Just like EVERYTHING in life: it comes down to money.  If no amount of money were to make you OK with guest #2, it's a hard "no."  Or, you can make it worth the stress/suffering.

And it's easy to do:

"I'm so sorry that my house rules were not clear when you made the reservation.  But to be clear: no additional guests are allowed.  Ever.  Anytime.  Any day.  Ever.  Period.  However, I want to help you out.  For $500/night, I'd be happy to host your additional guest."

Then see what he says.  You'd be shocked how many people out there pay ridiculous amounts for stupid things.  The older/wiser I get, the more I charge for stuff.  And even in absurd circumstances, people WILL pay! 

And if they don't want to pay?  That's great too!  Less work/stress for you.  And most importantly: you are ALWAYS in command.  

[Huma0]

@Richard531 

Yes, exactly. As long as they think it is for free, those extra guests, extra requests, exceptions, early check in, bag storage, late check out or whatever seem to be 'essential' for them, but it turns out that it's not so 'essential' when they have to pay for it. Suddenly, it's no big deal and they can easily make other arrangements. Funny that...

[Kitty-and-Creek0]

@Mita127 @Huma0 

My concern is that make an exception once, it will likely happen again. Also, since the original guest is not hot on respecting rules, there is a real chance that their guests will not be, either. It would seem that the registered guest should be responsible for the conduct of their visitors. There would also be the potential for insurance coverage  issues. Is it worth the stress to you to accommodate these wishes? It would be more practical imho for the visitor to stay in a motel and have your registered guest visit with them there.

[Huma0]

@Kitty-and-Creek0 

Yes, I totally agree. This guest does not sound like he can be trusted. Already, he is ignoring house rules so what is to say he is going to ensure his visitors do? It's highly unlikely.

I do allow my guests to have additional visitors but they need to ask in advance, give me the details of the person staying and pay for them, which I find helps to stop this kind of situation. Either they are respectful of this (I have had many situations where it is no problem at all), or they don't want to agree to it, in which case they don't get to have overnight guests or they don't book with me in the first place because I won't agree to them having people coming and going whenever without warning.

However, every now and then I simply the the guest no, they cannot have an overnight guest. That's in the situations where I think that it sounds like an all round bad idea. @Mita127's guest sounds like he fits in that category. Not only is he already ignoring numerous house rules, but he's got back chat about it too!

[Kitty-and-Creek0]

@Huma0 

With this  back-chatting housemate, who seems to think he has "tenant's rights" there, I'd do my level best to get him gone. I'm too old and territorial to accept that sort of stress, in my own house. It seems that with this weekend visitor there may be some bigger usage of the kitchen, which we've heard he is already not so considerate of. Perhaps he'll clean up after himself this time, in an attempt to impress the girl? My grandparents used to rent their many extra bedrooms to university students, in the 1950's and they never had this sort of situation. It's too bad this is happening to @Mita127  Such an uncomfortable and confrontational situation. Perhaps if he was there on a shorter stay he would not feel so entitled.

[Huma0]

@Kitty-and-Creek0 

Yep. Entitled is rather an overused word I feel, but in this case I think it is apt.

Guest attitude is basically, "Yeah, sure, I agreed to your house rules when I booked, but screw that, I don't need to follow them. I will do what is convenient to me and you will just put up with it because I want what I want."

Erm, no.

Honestly, I want to be a 'nice' persona and I am pretty flexible and accommodating in general, but I had learnt with hosting, it's better to draw a firm line. Every time I back down and let a guest break house rules, it just ends up with them taking that mile rather than the inch.

I am pretty lenient about smoking but I clearly state no smoking at all of illegal or recreational drugs. It's not a moral issue, but a practical one. I have to think of other guests and the smell is really obvious.

However, a few months ago, I had a guest who asked if it was okay to smoke weed in the garden. I don't normally allow this because of the neighbours and other guests. Still, I relented and said fine.

That guest and his boyfriend went on to smoke weed and cigarettes in the bedroom. There was no need as they had outdoor areas to do so, but they were too lazy. In addition, in order to hide this, they had the windows open in the middle of winter while the heating was on and then constantly complained that the room was freezing but refused to let me go in to check the heaters. 

I learnt my lesson. I should have firmly said no in the first place and reminded them that smoking weed is NOT allowed as per the house rules they agreed to. If they still went ahead and smoked anything in the bedroom, I should have again put my foot down and told them to stop or to leave.

[Mita127]

@Huma0 Wow! That's a terrible experience! That would have driven me mad. What happened to that booking? Did Airbnb give you any compensation for getting rid of the smoke smell? Have you ever had to tell a guest to leave early due to breaking the rules? 

I've not had to chuck out an Airbnb guest (YET!) as I've generally had good guests, fortunately. Having said that, I only accept a handful of booking requests and generally decline a lot of them as I now know what red flags to look out for, thanks to this community! And thanks for sharing your experiences, it's so useful! Someone really needs to put this into a proper hosting guidebook haha. 

[Huma0]

@Mita127 

No, in this case I just let it go.

Firstly, although the guests were complaining early on about the room being freezing, which I just couldn't understand, the penny didn't drop that they were smoking in the bedroom until a while later. They were doing it very late at night when they though everyone was asleep but I am a night owl, so I was sure I could smell something, plus they were stupid enough to leave the joint and cigarette buts in the bin in the bathroom closest to their room (no other bedrooms on that floor)!

This was later on in their stay and I'd already had to tell them off for being rude to me, plus there were other issues in terms of cleanliness, taking over communal spaces, all sorts of things, so I didn't even bring up the smoking issue. I was just happy when they were gone.

The room surprisingly did not smell that bad, but I guess that's because they probably had the windows wide open a lot of time (hence the room being freezing). Plus, there was a gap of several days before the next guest, so I was able to make sure any smell was gone.

Yes, I have asked one guest to leave for breaking house rules. You can read the details here, but read them at your peril. It's not a pretty story!

https://community.withairbnb.com/t5/Hosting/Condom-Girl-AKA-My-Weirdest-Guest/m-p/1223607#M294344

People have often told me I should write a book about my hosting experiences but, to be honest, I think that many hosts could write a book about it!

[Mita127]

@Huma0 Haha that post about your weirdest guest!! Bloody hell. She sounded properly unhinged. I'm impressed you have carried on hosting after that! 

Yes we definitely need a book about weirdest / worst guest experiences! 🙂 

[Kitty-and-Creek0]

@Huma0 

We have an extreme wildfire risk here, and there is no smoking of anything anywhere on our property. No open flames of any kind indoors or out. Due to too many years of exposure, I react to any kind of smoke, smelly chemicals, and airborne irritants.  If anyone were to smoke in my house, in violation of the rules,  they'd be pretty embarrassed.

The bit of opening windows in winter to let smoke out along with all the heat, is something everyone should know not to do. My opinion is, that if someone really has to get stoned, there are plenty of things they can eat which will do the trick without making a nuisance of themselves. 

Unfortunately, we are all somewhat careful about enforcing our rules, what with the threat of a scathing review hanging over our heads. Seems to me that this is one reason certain guests feel so empowered over us. There is also the possibility that some guests are just less considerate than most.

[Huma0]

@Kitty-and-Creek0 

I am not sure that these particular guests felt that empowered over me because of the review process. Perhaps they did. I am not sure. I think it was more a case of being entitled. I am not saying that in the way that "young people are SOOO entitled these days," as when I was young, I lived with several people who really behaved in a shocking way (theft, damages, including intentional vandalism, squalor etc.) in the places we rented. It's not a new problem.

When I told these guests that it was not okay to speak to me rudely, especially in my own home, they apologised very quickly! I don't think they were expecting that at all. They assumed because they were paying to rent a space that they could be have as they wished, but I quickly put an end to that assumption.

However, these guests had no clue. While they were not rude to me again, they continued to make mess and break house rules. The smoking was just one aspect. If it had been the only problem, probably I would have made a bigger deal of it! 

The other thing with guests smoking in bedrooms is that it's a fire hazard, even where wildfires etc are not a risk. Even if they do not set the house on fire, I really do not need burns on my upholstery etc. Luckily, these guests did not cause any permanent damage. The knocked a picture off a wall and created a really excessive amount of extra cleaning for me (besides the smoking). 

They were one of the bookings that persuaded me to turn off instant book, but also the booking that convinced me finally to no longer accept couples/pairs.