Fire safety

[Julie583]

Had a unplaned vist from a very nice fire office  today said my house  and family home which i host from needed expecting  as i receive payment for guests to stay i fall into fire restrictions i didnt no about .  Fire  doors Emergency lighting a wired in fire system  battery operated  is not good enough and  weekly fire testing log and a evaluation  plan for guests to read and sign on arrival  all this for a couple of rooms in a family home ??? And one else had this new information or inspection 

[Stephanie]

Hiya @Julie583 ,

Thanks for sharing, I'm just going to tag some other UK hosts in case they have some info @Kevin1322 @Helen3 @Paul1255 @Gordon0 @Roberta2 

Thanks

[Mike-And-Jane0]

@Julie583 It sounds like you fall under the definition of an HMO (house of multiple occupancy) which would cause you to need all the things you list.

I wonder if you should reduce your listing to one room (and a sitting room) whereupon you would fall under the governments rent a room scheme. This would also give you a tax advantage as the first 7000 (7500?) is tax free.

[Julie583]

Dodnt  no  what we fall under we are a family  this is are home i dodnt earn enough from air b and b to pay tax  under the government  rent a room scheme  but apparently  and body that receives  and payment  for a room now comes under new  rules  . Just  wanted  to check this was the case

[Helen3]

Sorry @Julie583  it's not clear from your post. What are the fire brigade asking you to do in addition to the measures you mention you already have in place???

[Helen427]

Hello @Julie583 

Gorgeous home you have.

If you don't already have them included in your listing, do get a Fire Extinguisher or two and include in your listing information where there's outdoor hoses in case of Fire emergencies.

Do you include information anywhere in your arrival details of a Fire Escape plan for Guests?
Maybe include one in your listing and place it in noticeable places.

Maybe someone who has an issue has reported you to the local fire department, hence the visit.

@Huma0, how do you address these these Fire Safety concerns in your home?

All the best from New Zealand

[Huma0]

@Helen427 

Thanks for bringing my attention to this topic. To be honest, I am not sure about the fire regulations regarding Airbnbs in the UK, but it is something I will be looking into.

As for HMOs, as mentioned by @Mike-And-Jane0 , from the information provided by my local council, I don't think that @Julie583 's Airbnb would be classified as an HMO, although I can't be sure without knowing her exact set up and the rules can vary between different local councils. If it were an HMO, a lot more would be required than just the fire safety measures, including obtaining a licence fro the council.

As far as I am aware, a lodging is only an HMO where there are tenants, i.e. people renting it as their only or main home and, even then, does not apply where there is a resident landlord and a maximum of two tenants. Hostels and B&Bs can also be classified as HMOs but only where these are being used as the residents' only home, e.g. those providing housing to the homeless. It does not apply to holiday makers and temporary visitors.

That being said, I would not be surprised if there are separate fire and safety regulations that apply to short term accommodation and holiday lets. I will see what I can find out about that.

As for my own home, I was aware that you need gas and electrical safety inspections/certificates when renting out rooms, so I have always got my yearly gas certificate and the electrical one is every three years (I also had the whole house rewired, new fuse box etc.). I have wired in smoke detectors with battery back up on every floor and two on the ground floor. Airbnb sent me an additional smoke/carbon monoxide detector for free. I do also have two fire extinguishers. Exterior fire hoses, however, are not really a thing here, and you don't usually see fire escapes on old houses.

I will certainly be thinking about updating the manual to include more information about escape routes and other safety instructions for guests.

[Julie583]

It is a family  home  with a top floor letting  was told weekly fire test and reconds need to be kept and this applies to anyone that receives  a payment of any kind for accommodation along with guests having to read and sign a fire escape  plan on arrival  . Luckily  for us the house was a care home before and has most of the list we need to apply to covered  or they would have shut us down on the spot.  Just wasnt made aware of these by air b and b  and think  i should have been 

[Helen3]

Sorry @Julie583  its not up to Airbnb to advise us as the business owner about how we should be complying with local regulations including fire safety.. they are simply one marketing and listing channel you can use to promote your business.

[John2406]

Hi @Julie583 That's a new one on me!

I mean to say, all Self Catering Accommodation providers' have to have a Fire Risk Assessment in place, as well as other items, but there isn't a legal requirement at the moment to have any Emergency Lighting  (although I do have two of them installed), one only would have Fire-doors installed if the property has three floors or more (in new builds the requirement might be more stringent), whilst we do have  wired-in fire alarms (with battery backup), but there again, that's more a case of installation of such being on a new-build (when I believe one also has to now have a fire sprinkler installed in every room).

Did you get the name and number of the "very nice fire office[r]" so that you can check back with his fire station that all was genuine with him?  I'm only asking, as Fire Officers doing a check usually attend a property upon request, so I do wonder whether, as @Helen427  suggested,  "Maybe someone who has an issue has reported you to the local fire department"!

Just as a matter of interest, what fire equipment do you have in the property, and do you have any notices up to say where people should go in the event of a fire?

All the best from South Wales (the orignal one!)_

[Julie583]

Not just self contained  now all accommodation  you receive a payment from  has to be risk assessment done  weekly fire log  and guest to read and sign a fire escape  plan on arrival  even if its a room in your family house .

[Mike-And-Helen0]

@Julie583 @Huma0 @John2406 @Helen427 @Helen3 

I fear you've been conned, possibly a neighbour is not happy?

This is for landlords

https://www.gov.uk/private-renting/your-landlords-safety-responsibilities

This is an HMO

 Does your family match this, it doesn't sound like it?

For lodgers including short term lettings

https://www.gov.uk/rent-room-in-your-home

[Julie583]

Thank you this was along the lines which i thought  i only do short term let but apparently  we all fall into the same  category now .if you receive  any payment for over night accommodation even one night the laws have changed the only people  who are resident are my family in  the house . Wish me luck 26th when i get a revist 

[Mike-And-Helen0]

Are you in England? Unless this is covered by devolved legislation I am smelling a rat.

Did they have ID or leave contact details?

The links above are off the gov website which is normally pretty up to date.

[Helen427]

@Julie583 
When you reply to others, a heads up, use the @ key before the persons name so others are aware of your posts to them.

One thing you need to be mindful of is the era your Residence was built as those Building Compliance Codes apply.

Try locate the earlier legislation relating to your home including that of Fire Safety for that era.

Unfortunately some Scientists/ Academics who are anti-coal and anti fires have been pushing changes to the style of homes of previous eras due to their lack of Critical Thinking and what materials and means of the day people had and used.

We all were taught to be careful with matches and had Fire Escape Routes ingrained in us by our parents, that's common sense to know those things.

We here in New Zealand have also been going through similar issues with Fire Safety alarms and compliance - Goodness knows who is making a bundle also out of AC/ Heat Pumps as frankly they are not needed in many homes.

We are also going through Insulation Regulations in Rentals without people factoring into account in days gone by in Heritage and other homes in those eras people used newspapers to cover walls and floors, then sacking and in subsequent years wallpaper for warmth together with a hand made carpet/ rug before being able to afford wool carpet - some think we should all be living in sealed up buildings made of synthetics.

Many homes are very much already in Compliance with Laws at the time they were built.

This document from 2001 may be of interest to some, note Eileen Pirie's  ( also known as Eileen POLGREEN) comments - she is the mother-in-law of Professor Neil Ferguson and her daughter is Kim Polgreen.

Flying Blind

https://www.usablebuildings.co.uk/UsableBuildings/Unprotected/FlyingBlind.pdf

@Julie583 @Mike-And-Helen0 @Huma0 @John2406 @Lizzie @Stephanie @Quincy  and all the others in the UK , Australia and New Zealand and wherever these Regulations are being imposed.