Guest Violates House Rules, Allowed to Stay for a Few Hours "to Decide".... Awkward

[Lisa1346]

Hello Community,

So this is probably part venting, part asking advice on how to approach a problem and what to expect. Here's the situation:

I rent out a whole house. Security cameras are throughout, excluding the bathrooms and bedrooms (of course!). The security cameras are disclosed in my listing and one of the house rules is "no tampering with the security cameras." Additionally, my dog and cat stay in the house when guests are not there. This is also disclosed in the listing. Guests are not allowed to bring pets. I truly understand that some people feel creeped out by security cameras and/or suffer from allergies/asthma aggravated by pet dander. This is why I have such disclosures. 

I received an 11 night booking (maybe time to turn off instant book?) from a guest with 5 adults and 1 child. He said they are coming to visit his parents in a nearby neighborhood. He has a long history on airbnb, with about 9 postive reviews from other hosts and about 20 from guests dating back to the 2010s. Surely a former host and experienced guest would know to read through the house rules and listing disclosures before booking, right?

So, they arrived last night and I check my cameras this morning to find that several of them have been taken offline at 5 a.m. Since my utility room cameras are on, I know that the others were unplugged. I sent a message asking the guest how the stay was going and to please plug the cameras back in:

Good Afternoon -----,

How's your stay going? Please let me know if you need anything.

Also, the office and living room security cameras were unplugged this morning. Could you please plug these back in and also check that the kitchen camera is plugged in? If you need outlets for charging your electronics, the power strips in the office and the sunroom are available.

Enjoy your stay,

Lisa

Guest response:

We don’t feel comfortable with cameras in the house so will plug cameras back in when we leave.

Today at 1:24 PM

House is ok Lisa, except the fact that there was a cat or dog in the house at some point in time. There hair is still in the carpet which is now causing serious problem with my asthma. Wasn’t the house description no pets??

While I appreciate that this guest was not hostile, why does he think he can pick and choose which house rules to follow? I think it's funny that he read the "No Pets" rule but disregarded the "No Tampering with security cameras" rule. Since the house was vacuumed thoroughly, I suspect he didn't actually find hair in the carpet, but saw the cat and dog supplies in storage. Anywho, my response stated nothing that should come as a surprise:

Hello -----,

I'm sorry you are having these problems. The house rules say no pets (for guests) and no tampering with the security cameras. The description does disclose both that pets live in the house and that security cameras are in the house excluding the bedrooms and bathrooms (of course).

I realized that I had given the guests a chance to abide by the rules and they declined ("we'll plug them back in when we leave.") So, I called Airbnb. They promptly agreed that it was a rule violation. I agreed to refund the guest the nights that they don't stay.  Airbnb said they would call the guest and allow them some time to decide whether they wanted to comply with the rules or leave. Per airbnb, the guest opted to take "a couple hours"  to decide. I feel like if the guests opt to plug in the cameras and stay, I'm just getting set up for a bad review from them. Since they already stayed one night, can they leave a bad review anyway? I hope they leave for everyone's sake... I don't want to continue to host someone who disrespects my rules and the guest with asthma should find other accomodations for his own sake.

This is very awkward as a host. I don't know if I should be making plans to kick them out or what. On other hand, why do rule violating guests even get the choice between staying and leaving? 

One last rant: guests need to stop treating listing details like the superfine print nobody reads before they agree to terms. The listing contents are not just advertisments and fluff. They often contain valuable information about the listing so you know exactly what to expect. 

Thanks for letting me vent and thanks in advance for your advice and stories.

[Lisa723]

@Lisa1346 ugh... yes they will be able to review, regardless. Hopefully they decide to leave. Your responses were great.

[Sammy35]

ugggggh the nerve of people.  anyone who doesn't want cameras is up to no good and should book a hotel and stay out of elevators  (remember jay z lol).

same happened to me but with a third party booking (who i guess booked for his friends, showed up, left and never returned) that never said he was a third party booker and when his errr "travel companion" arrived (with another friend from long island) (i was told they were traveling togther,, nope booking guy drove from philly) and herd about the home security i thought he would faint.  contacting booking guest do you need to add a third yeah whatever, no not whatever you have to go into our itin and add him and it will generate supplemental payment.  texted him.  emailed him.  texted friend, emailed friend (i made sure #2 had a profile attached to itin).  radio silence.  f that **bleep**, we're out partying...

they still attempted cockroach guests.  ones that appear in the dark and scatter when you turn the light on.  i literally staked out my own **bleep** house that night and was waiting for them at 3am (all 5--2 were booked, the one that was must have gotten lucky, never saw his jeep until  next day) when they entered the vestibule.  camera flash!  hello goodbye, friend that works for popo came to meet me in uniform.  that very point i didn't care if i ever hosted again.  no way was this happening in my home.  ALWAYS HAVE A LOCK THAT ONLY YOU CAN LOCK AND OPEN!  ALWAYS!

i literally went cuckoo that night.  it was the worst airbnb customer service experience until i talked to someone in charge at 10am the next am.   booking guy in jeep didn't return till noon, all their stuff neatly piled at front door by 3:30 am.   WITH NO REFUND WHATSOEVER.  maybe airbnb put them up somewhere don't know don't care.  thank god for trusting neighbors who let me stalk this.  i felt crazy.

go go go that deserves a kickout.  at least you offered a refund to faciliate the outing.  but you also have to be prepared for any kickback.  i was.  you may not be.  but remember, guests are smart enough to realize properly worded PC review disputes.

HIDDEN (I CALL THEM NON VISIBLE CCTV NO AUDIO) CAMERAS MI AMIGA.  REITERATE IN APPROVAL NOTICE.  YOU HAVE 47 HOURS TO CANCEL WITH NO PENALTY 3X A YEAR....blah blah

at least airbnb supported you.  SORT OF.  proof proof proof

[Gordon0]

>>anyone who doesn't want cameras is up to no good and should book a hotel<<

Sorry, @Sammy35, that's complete tosh. Outside a property, fine, one that's watching you watch TV or eat? I can't imagine there's a huge market 'enjoying' that. 

[Susan17]

@Gordon0 

"....one thats watching you watch TV or eat? I can't imagine there's a huge market enjoying that"

You haven't seen Gogglebox or Come Dine With Me? 😉

[Gordon0]

Funny, @Susan17, that made me laugh 🙂 

[Lisa1346]

@Susan17 Oh my, I haven't seen those. The TV is in the room with a pull-out couch, so I treat that as a bedroom for security camera purposes (ie none). The cameras also don't cover the dining room. I imagine if I did have dining room/tv room footage, I would be posting about a guest trying to charge me for the footage! Haha! 

[Sammy35]

---

@Gordon0 wrote:

the good thing about me is that IDGAF what you think gordon.  and since this is more a "hobby", and used when i'm not here, and not important income, also IDGAF about guests who don't "watching you watch TV or eat?"  I can't imagine there's a huge market 'enjoying' that.  or whatever you are banging on about.  i want guests who can still feel insanely welcome who are showering and sleeping here and out on the town, not hanging out and that's about it.  i'm not a breakfast BNB or an airbnb experience.  and what i do works for me.   you surely need not concern yourself with it.

so when it shows, because most people are NOT creeping, because most of us aren't actually creepers and don't give enough Fs for that, that people are vaping, smoking pot, doing drugs, nosing in ish they shouldn't in my living room, and trying to sneak people in through windows not a front or back door, you bet your sweet "tosh" whatever that means its of interest to me.  and that's really the only one i care about.  and my neighbors.

no diff that mothers who want nanny cams far as i'm concerned.

YOU DO YOU!  i'll do me.

ps. if you ever need some coaching about how to properly directly address someone (id think you'd already know about proper behavior given you live in england lmao) you are trying to instigagte and confront or shame, be sure to let me know.  i coach execs for a living and can certainly help you articulate yourself better!  be happy to help you decide when and where to give your unsolicited feedback!  for shizzle.

---

[Lisa1346]

Sammy, I am sorry you had that awful hosting experience. Thank you for sharing your story. 

I think the important thing with security cameras is that the potential guests can make an informed decision. Basically, if they don't want a place with security cameras, they should be able to find the the security camera disclosure in the listing and avoid booking places with security cameras. At the end of the day, guests who object to security cameras have a choice to book security camera free listings. 

I think your point on being able to control the locks is very valid. I have had several people leave the door unlocked upon checkout and the only way I can know when I am out of town is by logging onto the interior camera focused on the entry door.

[Gordon0]

I just checked out your listing, @Lisa1346, and I don't think the mention of your CCTV cameras (in common areas) is prominent enough as it means scrolling way down below the 'main' stuff. On a personal level, I think it's properly creepy and had I 'missed' it before booking I'd be pretty upset with myself.

I think these guests have realised they've messed up by booking a place with overly intrusive security in the first place and the pet stuff mighty be an 'add on'.

Had I stayed in your property I would certainly be (respectfully) mentioning the CCTV, regardless of whether it was somewhere in the lisitng blurb.    

Good luck with fixing this. 

[Kaylee18]

@Lisa1346  .. I find this sooo interesting. I live in Canada, so I don't know the laws or rules in the States for having cameras inside a rental unit... but I did stumble across this article from an american airbnb guest that I found interesting. The writer states: 

Laws on this sticky subject vary from state to state and sometimes, city to city. There is no over-riding federal law. But in general, local and state laws usually permit landlords to install cameras in “public spaces.” This is an important distinction. Private areas, like bedrooms and bathrooms, or anywhere else that anyone would reasonably expect privacy are off limits.

https://www.foxnews.com/tech/watch-out-for-indoor-spy-cameras-when-renting-a-house-apartment-or-room

If I was renting an airbnb I would "reasonably expect privacy" in the entire  unit.  I'd think the same for a hotel room. 

I understand your listing says you have cameras....but I also TOTALLY understand how those guests were put off by it (and obviously did not see it in the listing).  I hope they decided to leave for you. I know if I found cameras in my rental, I'd be peacing out! LOL 

Best of luck! 

[Jessica-and-Henry0]

@Lisa1346 

I agree with @Gordon0 that you definitely need to make it waaaaaaaaa~y more clear about surveillance IN your home of the common spaces and about pets. Mentioning something like this only 1 time under "You must also acknowledge" (which is at the absolute bottom of the listing description) is not enough. 

It should be in your "summary" blurb. And again in your "the space" and "other things to note" and "house rules". And this should be reiterated to ALL guests in your "thanks for booking" message which is sent immediately after a booking is confirmed so that anyone who is not comfortable or happened to miss it can cancel quickly and move on.

I have nothing to hide, but I certainly don't want a random stranger to have videos of me in my PJs walking around the house or snuggling on the sofa watching TV or eating ice cream and pizza in the kitchen~!!!!!!  And I'm not allergic but I'm not a fan of places that "smell like dog" - which is usually the case for homes that have pets and have wall to wall carpeting. No matter how well you vaccum, it won't get rid of "dog smells". 

[Lisa1346]

Thanks for reading and commenting. I have read and enjoyed some of your comments on other posts in the community as well, so thanks for your contributions!

As I have noted in my original posting, I appreciate that many people will not want to book a listing with interior security cameras or pets. These people should be reading the description and not booking a listing with these disclosures. Interestingly enough, I don't think I've ever seen a guest eating pizza and ice cream in the kitchen - I have a dining room that is not covered by the cameras. 

I will be taking your advice and making the disclosures on pets and cameras more visible and adding it to my welcome message.

[Jessica-and-Henry0]

@Lisa1346 

Of course people SHOULD read everything thouroughly but reality is we're lucky if guests even click on "Read more about this space" and glance at our descriptions. And the fact that House Rules are at the absolute bottom of the listing page, plus guests have to click again on "Read all rules" to even see "You must also acknowledge" means that there is a high probablity that people will miss critical information provided under these categories. 

Just a suggestion........ why not show in your listing photos where the indoor cameras are located, what direction they are aimed at and what areas they cover? Guests seem to take a better look at the photos than the descriptions or house rules. A photo of your pets and a short explanation that while you do not allow guests to bring pets, your home is not pet-free because of your own pets could also help make things more clear. 

[Lisa1346]

@Jessica-and-Henry0  Yes, agreed, guests don't like to scroll down, so it's very silly that airbnb has the rules under everthing else. I wonder why they decided to do that. 

I like your photo ideas! In addition to including the pets and cameras, I'm going to try to add the rule/disclosure list as a photo. 

Thanks again!