How much should bad hosting factor into a rating? What can we do about bad hosts on Airbnb?

[Charlie349]

I'm writing this as a previous 5-star host and now, an extremely disgruntled guest.

Should there be separate host vs accomodation ratings?

Overall, I think there should be two different ratings for a host and for a property. We had a pretty nice property but the host was awful. I gave the property 5 stars but if I could rate the host, it would be -100. I try and be positive with my experiences - for hosts, it can mean a vital source of income and if I like a place then I try and see passed bad hosting. A private constructive message on improving could work but I don't think it goes far enough.

Generally, as a host I've had really good guest experiences. I regretted 1 or 2 experiences but felt maybe I should've been more communicative and saw these more as failings on my part rather than the guest.

Discounting disputes

After an intense lockdown in Barcelona, we were looking for a place on the Spanish Coast with a pool to relax. Apparently, due to C-19 some pools can't open/ take precautions not to open which we weren't aware of on the listing details or description. If it's for health and safety in a community setting, I can completely understand that. However, I think it's unreasonable to maintain a high price for a property that prominently features and is priced with a pool.

Just over 48 hours before we arrived the hosts said the pool would be closed for our trip. We were disappointed but politely asked if there would be any discount for this. The host didn't think this was an issue, said we had good value for money and if we wanted a discount we should cancel the trip. It was a very abrupt and rude message to our request.

I contacted Airbnb support to find out what would happen - could we book somewhere else using the credit or would we lose all our money due to the cancellation policy? I can appreciate they have resource constraints but I still haven't got a message back after asking this 5 days ago.

I tried to keep things cordial and said it was a shame we couldn't get a discount but otherwise we looked forward to visiting the place. It felt very awkward communicating with them at this point.

We had a reasonably nice stay - the view was great, the WiFi was terrible, it had good features but bad DIY meant a wooden plank above the door fell on my head. After a few days of relaxing, the negative host experience was somewhat behind me and I wrote a nice 5 star review. 

However, the host completely trashed my Airbnb profile and even negatively commented on my good review of his property.

As a host, charging a €90 cleaning fee, how much is reasonable for a guest to clean up?

We were asked to bring our own bedsheets, towels and bath mat (this is the first time I've experienced this). We made the bed when we arrived and stripped it when we left. We wiped all the surfaces, left some cleaned dishes on a drying rack and also had some dishes washing in the dishwasher when we checked out. Nothing in the sink, nothing on the surfaces etc. I took the trash bags outside the door and asked the lady who greeted us where I should put them as we were in a large apartment complex and I was unsure of the best place to put them/ where the trash went.

The host said we treated the place like a hotel, we didn't return it how it was given to us and we wanted them to take out our trash. Completely untrue.

So, if you're charging a €90 cleaning fee - what is expected of the guest?

As a "virtual" host, how responsive should you be/ expect your guests to be?

Our hosts lived in another country so they had someone local greet us at the property (there was a 3 hour check-in window between 4pm and 7pm).

We had to coordinate times directly with her. We messaged an estimated time of 6pm arrival (we were driving around the area during the day so were unsure exactly when we'd arrive). At 3pm we asked if it was possible to change it to 4:45pm but could always meet a bit later. She was clearly annoyed in her messages and said she'd have to change her schedule and would meet us at 5pm.

She checked us in and with broken Spanish between us, we had our Airbnb.

The hosts messaged later saying that she had notified them we had checked in and arrived. They sent a few messages over the next few days saying we hoped we enjoyed the area and the sun. No questions, just a general "hope you're enjoying your stay". I didn't message the host. I really didn't want to interact with them at this point because I just wanted to enjoy my holiday and not spend time on my phone. They weren't asking any key questions, just generally messaging me.

At 5:30pm the night before we checked out, they asked us to coordinate a check out time. Given I had been at the beach, drove home and was relaxing, they messaged again at 9pm saying we had to reply. I instantly messaged the lady to check out and said her suggested time on 11:30am was ok.

They said I wasn't responsive at all to their messages.

I have asked Airbnb to take down my positive review but looking at this from both a host and guest experience, I really struggle with the fact that there aren't better mechanisms which limit this type of arrogant hosting.

As a guest, they have trashed my profile for future stays. They do not deserve to be part of what I expect to be a high standard of friendly, fair and flexible hosting.

It has completely ruined the experience for me and what I thought other hosts in the community were like.

How do we reduce this type of hosting in the community?

[Anonymous]

@Charlie349   Reviews never have to be solely about the property - they're supposed to take into account the whole hospitality experience. That's why there are ratings for qualities like Communication, Accuracy, and Value - and it sounds like you had an unsatisfying experience on all three of those fronts. 

What can you do about it? Well, you had the chance to write an honest review with constructive feedback. The result would not have been that the host gets kicked off the platform, but it would have helped future guests make an informed decision.

On the question of how this host's review will impact your profile, unfortunately your public response is probably the more damaging element. The intended audience for the response is not the host, but rather future hosts considering your request. Why would you want them to see you in this light?

[Charlie349]

Thanks @Anonymous - you are right. I am annoyed that I chose to still try and be positive about the experience in my initial feedback and then let the host's negative comments on my profile get the best of me.

I had an opportunity to give a lower score and didn't. I have removed my review of the place and will look at removing my response to his comments. Appreciate the feedback!

[Mike-And-Jane0]

@Charlie349 To answer the question 'What can we do about bad hosts on Airbnb?'  the most important thing you can do is to leave an honest review. Sadly it appears you didn't do this.

[Gordon0]

Like @Anonymous says, @Charlie349, reviews aren't just about the property, and I'd actually give hosting skills/welcome etc. a similar weighting, especially when - as you've you've encountered - things don't turn out as expected. 

I've rated guests and hosts poorly in the past - where they've merited it - for poor communication skills. 

While I too would have complained (and left an appropriate review) given your experience, I'm afraid your response is a proper shot in the foot and has an air of petulance about it, especially the 'I'm too busy to spend ten seconds sending a message'.

As for 'Should there be separate host vs accommodation ratings?', I'd say no; a good guest should be a good host. 

Sorry this hasn't ended well for you.      

[Gordon0]

I seem to have mis-answered your question, @Charlie349. My answer should have been that a good listing should come with a good host. The two are not mutually exclusive IMO.

I'd take a leaf from @Elena87's Depp vs. Heard book and see if you can kill off your response. 

[Charlie349]

@Gordon0 I appreciate the feedback! It will definitely change my approach to future reviews. It's been an unfortunate series of events and I wish there had been better outcomes and that I wrote a more constructive response to his comment.

[Emilia42]

@Charlie349 

It is so important for guests and hosts to own their reviews. Too many times on this forum we see one party regretting the review they have left because the other party did not leave a favorable review in return. If this host left you a great review, do you think you would still be questioning your review of him? I don't think so. We shouldn't look back in hindsight but instead, write reviews that are truthful to one's own experience regardless of what is reviewed in return. 

I don't think that you should consider reviewing the host separate from the accommodation. You are reviewing your experience. And that includes your communication with the host, the service that was provided, and how comfortable the host made you feel. 

The unfortunate thing about all reviews is that we all have different experiences. Responding to a message 2 hours later would be considered late to some and within a reasonable timeframe to others. This is a person's personality showing through to a review. There is nothing we can do about it. But we can still own our reviews and comment appropriately in response.

[Charlie349]

Very wise words @Emilia42 - thank you! 

You are 100% correct - if he wrote me a good review, it would be water under the bridge. Instead, I found myself going atomic. I should've left a more realistic review that my experience that was far from perfect.

It was an unfortunate mismatch between my expectations as a guest and his expectations as a host with comments I regret.

[Elena87]

@Charlie349 

I understand the review left for you has you smarting, but you are letting your emotions take you to a Johnny Depp v Amber Heard drama level.

I'd consider doing a reverse ferret, ask airbnb to please review your public response with a view to removing it, it doesn't reflect well on you and seems done in self justification and anger.

Next time you are in Spain, the phrase that pays is

Donde estan los contenedores de basura?

[Charlie349]

Thanks @Elena87! I will see what I can do about amending the response.

[Mark116]

@Charlie349  I'm not sure this was really a 'bad' host.  While I agree that you should have been given a partial refund for no pool use, the host did tell you in advance and gave you the option of cancelling.  Since you ended up giving a 5 star review, the lack of pool must not have been that bad in the end.

Similarly, it can be a pain to have to coordinate a specific check in time, but there are plenty of listings that allow for 100% self check in, you chose a listing where someone was meeting you and then were unhappy about it, I think that's on you. 

I'm surprised as a host that you would resent your host messaging you to see how you were doing and if you needed anything, etc.  This is the essence of 'hospitality' and of airbnb being different from a hotel.  As a host, I am always disappointed when I send messages to guests who never bother to respond and then give a low rating for some random reason they never mentioned.

[Sarah977]

@Charlie349  Airbnb won't let you amend anything. All they will let you do is request that it be removed in its entirety. Whenever you have the need to leave a response, whether to a review of you as a guest or a review that has been left for you as a host, it's always best to sit on it for awhile, letting the raw emotion subside, so you can write something that is simply factual rather than defensive or aggressive.

The reason that reviews stay with the profiles, rather than the property, when a place changes hands, is that it's really all about the host. Say a host has a luxury condo in an upscale neighborhood. Well, that host could fill the place with broken, junky furniture, rusty second-hand appliances, not attend to proper cleaning, etc. Have an attitude, like your host did. Conversely, a place could be a simple cabin in the woods, but lovingly and artistically outfitted, super clean, with an attentive and friendly host. It's really all about the hosting.

As far as what you did wrong versus what the host or manager did wrong- I think that resenting spending a few seconds answering the host's messages was rather rude- it wouldn't have ruined your vacation to say, "Yes, we're comfortable and settled and are enjoying the area,  thanks for asking."

As far as the clean-up you did before you left, it sounds just fine and the manager reporting otherwise is really off.