Really Horrible Airbnb nightmare- how do you warn others?

[Lauren2655]

I rented a property a few miles outside of Taos for a month to work quietly and remotely in Covid times. I drove from Wisconsin and when I got to the property it was so off the beaten path, I was given coordinates by the owner (who lives in Tennessee) to find it. It was still light out and I was having a difficult time finding the property. There were some paved roads, but my GPS was also telling me to go through mud roads. It had recently snowed and thawed-the entire area was a mud pit. My prius got stuck in the mud and neighbors thankfully helped me out, as the sun was setting, I was all alone and tow companies were either closed or said they didn't have the capacity to help with mud tows (which I found surprising). After I got out, the neighbors took me to a road they thought was the right one. I got stuck again and now it was dark and was totally alone. Crying, I walked in the mud to a trailer and knocked on the door. The neighbors revealed they had covid but would try and get someone to help. Thankfully, they did and I was pushed again out of the road. I decided to get a motel room and demand from the owner someone accompany me to the property in the morning, which he complied to. The next day his very nice property manager drove me to another mud road that I had to turn down to get to the property-the owner said it was paved. The mud was so thick, my car would never have made it and even the property manager said his truck was having trouble.   All during a month it was going to snow and thaw-this means I would have been stuck there, literally. I was able to get a full refund but after spending 200 on motels, probably damaging my car and not being able to rent anything else in the area affordably-I had booked this place in the summer. I'm thankful to have gotten a refund but I'm not even allowed to leave a review or warning for others? I checked the listing again-even after this incident, he still "recommends" 4WD for " bumpy, dirt" roads. That's not what this was. My prius could have handled that. I have used Airbnb for many years with mostly no issues, except for horrible customer service. This feels really shady. Anyways-I had nowhere else to get it off my chest. I'm still shaken up and have to drive down to Albuquerque where I could find an affordable place with help from a family member. 

[Anonymous]

@Francesco1366  Yes we're beating a dead horse now, but it's abundantly clear that neither the host nor the guest thought the details of this booking through as well as they needed to. Both made poor assumptions based on limited information, and I hope they both learned from their mistakes.

Peer to peer commerce can only thrive if both peers accept responsibility for their outcomes and make an earnest effort to mitigate their risks. I don't think we disagree on how hosts can conduct themselves most professionally, but Airbnb was designed as a plug-and-play product for total amateurs, so there's no point in getting all outraged that sometimes they make amateurish mistakes.

[Francesco1366]

@Anonymous 

you are right but as you know in the commerce there is a seller and a buyer. It is the seller who must warn buyer that the pc has some particular characteristics not normal, for example a button that comes off with temperatures below 10 degrees. That's normal, according to law and moral. Responsibility for me is not to have doubts about who should have it on the house and its ad, the host!

But of course I agree with you, full of people who buy with eyes closed, even on Airbnb. Full of not correct sellers. Many more questions should be asked everywhere. But these sacrosanct advices becomes such a necessity as to make the buyer responsible like the seller, only in the infamous places where there are no laws to protect the weak part, the buyer. Here on Airbnb we are serious, we can never overshadow the responsibility of the host, the seller, who has legal and moral responsibility for the ads.

My opinion, of course there are a lot of points of view.

[Anonymous]

@Francesco1366  You can argue about moral responsibility and best practices all you want, and that's fine - nothing wrong with a little idealism. But holding your values sacrosanct is little use when you have to make a practical decision in an imperfect system, and deal with imperfect people with their own agendas and values. 

If you find yourself stuck in a mud pit on a dark mountain road, the Moral High Horse is not going to come to your rescue. 

[Francesco1366]

you're right ... but didn't you notice that I also talked about legal responsibility? Morale and legal = law. @Anonymous 

[Anonymous]

@Francesco1366  You might also notice that Airbnb listings in most places exist well outside of legal regulation. Whenever it can get away with it, Airbnb disavows any responsibility for its hosts' adherence to local permits, taxes, health and safety requirements, fire codes, and other laws that are routinely applied to conventional accommodations like hotels. 

If you want to go shopping for anything in an unregulated marketplace, you know you're trading off some of your legal protections as a consumer. 

You're starting to remind me a bit of the guy who started this thread:  https://community.withairbnb.com/t5/Help/Staying-at-a-multi-guest-home-and-other-guest-is-coughing/m...

[Francesco1366]

@Anonymous 

I know well, I'm Italian. Pasta, pizza and illegal house in Airbnb. It's a classic. But not all of them are illegal and illegal does not mean necessarly not responsible. Do you believe that if I rent an illegal house I am no longer responsible for my actions with the guest? Absolutely not correct and I'm sure you agree. Just a misunderstandig.

I'm starting to believe that maybe you think I'm idiot 🤔 Thanks for not saying this explicitly 🤣

I understand your apocalyptic vision, I repeat that I do not agree with it. I respect a lot your point of view and I appreciate your comments. Thank you!

[Lawrene0]

Thanks for this update, @Lauren2655 ! It is going to be more important than ever that you write a review. "A little bumpy" in a sedan is no proper warning, even with the all-caps "BUT". 

If you had read a review that said the road could get so muddy as to be impassable in anything other than a 4WD raised vehicle, you would never have booked. An honest review will keep your experience from happening to someone else -- someone who may not have your perseverance and your luck finding help. You can word it so you bear part of the blame if you like: e.g., "I wish I had known more about the roads!" 

Are things going better in Albuquerque? Hope so. 

[Lauren2655]

Thank you-I agree. And now I guess it is allowing me to write a review. I've gone back and forth. Part of me feels like because I got a full refund I shouldn't leave one. But it was such a traumatic and scary experience, I feel like I morally must. I'm ok in Abq. It wasn't the experience I was looking for. I wanted a "writer's retreat" type environment and I had booked in July. I rented my place out in Madison and saved money to do this. So it's a bit disappointing but I'm trying to make the best of it and will try to do some day trips around southern New Mexico!

[Lisa723]

@Lauren2655 your review needn't tear the listing or the host apart; it should just be factual. You had difficulty finding the place with the directions provided, and ultimately couldn't reach it because the road was impassable due to mud. That's really all you need to say to let future prospective guests know what they need to know. Your emotional response to the misadventure isn't particularly relevant in this context.

[Sarah977]

@Lauren2655 Try to realize that it was a scary and traumatic experience for you, not objectively.  It might not have been for someone else- if they had plenty of daylight, if they weren't traveling alone, if they had experience with driving in challenging circumstances, and depending on their attitude and personality, they might have just considered it a crazy adventure that they'd laugh about. So as Lisa says, just be factual- the purpose of the review is to let other guests know what they could expect based on your experience, and for guests to make sure to ask what kind of shape the road is in, depending on the time of year. 

[Lauren2655]

@Sarah977 While I hear what you're saying-I'm not a novice traveler and work/live in India for months at a time, sometimes using airbnb there. I did have plenty of daylight-that went away when my car was stuck in the mud for hours a few days before daylight savings time. I have a lot of experience traveling alone as a 41 year old woman in all sorts of situations and truly I am not easily rattled. I can imagine someone with way less experience than me having a much more difficult and dangerous experience. This was objectively a dangerous situation. I didn't add to the story a situation that happened with a neighbor who helped me get my car out and then tried to shake me down for 1200, while threatening me during my stay there- where the police had to be called. I thought it would take away from the logistics of the road debacle. But this was a horror story that could have been so for most- particularly if they were a woman traveling alone.  Ultimately, the host had a responsibility to let me know that my car , one he knew I was driving, would not have been able to access the .8 mile road you have to take to get to the property at this time of year. He didn't know that because he is young, naive, green and not from that area. And now he's out of 1000 dollars and I got screwed. If I learned anything, it is only to rent places with very established hosts and reviews. And that sucks for those starting out-but it was what I did before this and what I'll do after. 

[Lisa723]

@Lauren2655 be careful-- if you include "irrelevant" information, that comments on experiences outside the host's control, the host can get your review removed according to Airbnb's content policy. And the fact that somebody tried to shake you down before you got to the property, while horrifying, is definitely irrelevant according to this policy. If your goal is to inform other guests, stick to the simple facts related to your experience of the listing itself.

[Lauren2655]

That's what I'm going to do. the neighbor situation was horrific. But the issue that put me in that situation was about the roads. And that's all I want to convey. 

[Sarah977]

I definitely wasn't trying to insinuate that you're some incapable woman who can't handle themselves in challenging circumstances without having some freaked-out meltdown. It's just that 5 different people could be put in exactly the same circumstances, no matter what those were, and have 5 different reactions. (I can imagine most guests being grossed out, for instance, to find the previous guests' leftover food in the fridge, but a bunch of 20 year old guys might think they scored by finding some slices of uneaten pizza, a half a jar of peanut butter and a half loaf of bread they could wolf down)

So our emotions about something are certainly valid for us personally, but when we write reviews, both as hosts and guests, facts are what should be conveyed, is what I was getting at. 

@Lauren2655

[Helen350]

...not just 20 year old guys, @Sarah977 ! 😉😋🍕🍞🥜😁