Resevation Request from Unvaccinated Guests

[Peter1]

A member of my local hosting community group recently posed a question about hosting unvaccinated Guests.  With her permission to share her post, this is what she asked:

"Well, here is a dilemma. I'm copying a message from a potential guest, in slightly edited form, below. I can't decide which way to go with this request.

 

' ... our family would like to rent your place in August. My brother and his wife ... have chosen not to become vaccinated and I’m hoping we can still rent your place as the vaccination requirements have relaxed. He has had Covid and recovered and she was with him during the entire time. This happened about a year ago. Hope you consider letting us stay at your place. ... '

 

In general, I don't agree with people's decision not to be vaccinated. But should I refuse to host them on that basis? Our apartment is separate from my living area; would unvaccinated people pose a risk to my health, or the health of our neighbors? I'm really unsure about this and would appreciate your advice! Thanks, in advance."

 

Many in our group suggested to go ahead and accept the request since her living space is separate from the Guest's. 

 

Would you accept this request and would your answer be different if this was a shared living space situation?

[Pat271]

This is really a personal decision. Hosts should do what causes them the least anguish. Judging by the hesitation, my guess is that this host should take the side of being more cautious.

Some people are really chill about Covid at this point, and others are the opposite - extremely upset that mandates are being lifted.

Most of us probably lie somewhere in-between. I don’t think even an epidemiologist can tell at this point the odds of spreading the virus in a given community, and how serious it would be for each individual.

Frankly, I’m rather surprised the guest opened up about their vaccination status. I don’t think most hosts ask for vaccination records. I’ve probably hosted a few unvaccinated guests during the past 2 years, as I don’t ask for records. The guest here has shown a certain sense of responsibility to have shared this. That alone would be meaningful to me.

The only advice I would give past that is to at least follow the mandates and guidelines of the specific governments, national and local. It will possibly avoid conflicts later to be in-step with the rest of the community. However, if hosts are comfortable with more restrictive guidelines, they should go with those.

[Branka-and-Silvia0]

Vaccinated people can get sick and spread the virus the same as non vaccinated so what's the difference? I am also an off-site host but I meet my guests at arrival and clean after them.  I would accept such booking, same as I accept all bookings and I don't care and never ask my guests if they are vaxed or not.

I am not vaccinated and didn't have covid.

[Nanxing0]

@Branka-and-Silvia0 People wearing a seatbelt while driving/riding can still get killed in an accident so what's the difference? There are people who never wear seatbelt and never had any issue, while there are people killed with seatbelt buckled.

The argument about vaccination is all about REDUCING THE RISK in a population. When a population of, say a million, people are mostly vaccinated, the virus spreading is significantly reduced, as well as hospitalization and death. You need to understand some basic statistics to be able to judge the effectiveness of vaccines. If you don't have such knowledge, just listen to what scientists say. I'm glad to hear that you didn't have covid, but that doesn't prove your point.

As for individuals, people all have different situations that affect their decision of either getting vaccinated or not, and should be all respected. Hosts should make their own decision based on specific situations.

[Huma0]

@Peter1 

From what I understand, being vaccinated does not stop one catching COVID, but it reduces the symptoms and the possibility of serious illness/hospitalisation/death. So, in theory, not being vaccinated does not so much pose a risk to the vaccinated people you come into contact with as much as to yourself.

Having said that, personally, I would prefer my guests to be vaccinated if possible and this is more of a moral thing. For sure, people have various reasons to be vaccinated or not (some I think valid and some not so much, e.g. "just didn't get around to it" or "didn't want a sore arm for a day") and we all have freedom of choice, but here in the UK where we have a stressed but highly valued public healthcare system, I'm not a huge fan of people who unduly put additional pressure on that system and deny others of treatment they might desperately need. Again, that's my own political/moral position. 

So, in short, it's a personal judgement here.

[Sarah977]

@Huma0  "So, in theory, not being vaccinated does not so much pose a risk to the vaccinated people you come into contact with as much as to yourself."

But I have also read that an unvaccinated person who has Covid carries a higher viral load than a vaccinated person who contracts it. They are more contagious and therefore can infect others, even those who are vaxed, more easily.

[Huma0]

@Sarah977 

I don't know if that's true or not. Quite possibly. 

I know I feel safer if I am surrounded by vaccinated people. Maybe it's not even because they are vaccinated so much as I feel they are being careful and care about others, especially the vulnerable??

Again perhaps I am being judgemental but, having been fully vaccinated, inclining the booster, and really not having grown an extra limb or spontaneously combusting, I think it's reasonable to expect I can set those rules in my own household at least. I don't force anyone to have the vaccine, just like I don't force anyone to book my listings.

[Sarah977]

@Huma0  Yes, I only hang out with people I know are vaxed these days, and know they take Covid seriously enough to mask up in public, as I do. And the immunocompromised, like my friend who is a cancer survivor, aren't taking any chances and are a pretty safe bet to hang with. 

[Nanxing0]

@Sarah977 @Huma0 Basically, the vaccine works for a population, not necessarily for an individual because everyone has different reaction to the vaccine. There are some people who never catch the disease even joined several covid parties while there are some people getting breakthrough even fully vaccinated.

The point is that if there's one guest unvaccinated then you probably don't need to worry too much because you don't really know the specific situation of this single person. However if you take in probably 100 unvaccinated guests then it gives you a higher risk than if you take in 100 vaccinated guests. The same idea applies to employers who require employees to vaccinate -- if you have ~100 employees working indoor then having them mostly vaccinated will substantially reduce the risk of massive workspace contract. However if there are only a few employees then it probably doesn't make too much difference.

Remember, there are also many people with natural immunity, knowingly or unknowingly, by contracting the virus. And it is a known fact that natural immunity through contracting the virus is better than the vaccine.

[Sarah977]

@Nanxing0 "And it is a known fact that natural immunity through contracting the virus is better than the vaccine."

A known fact? That's patently false.

[Huma0]

@Nanxing0 @Sarah977 

I have also heard a few people saying this lately but having COVID doesn't make you immune to the virus. Perhaps it increases your immunity and you won't get as sick next time round, but anyone who thinks they can't get it again should think twice. I know someone who has had COVID THREE times already.

[Nanxing0]

@Huma0 No it doesn't. And there's almost no disease that anyone can be "immune" to it. The problem always lays in the amount of antigen you are exposed to within a short time. Anyone exposed to sufficient amount of antigen of any type can contract the disease. The only difference is the consequence -- how sick you'll get/if it's life-threatening, how long it takes for recovery, and if there's any sequelae. Getting the vaccine will most likely make you partially immune, meaning if you get it, would most likely be a course of cold and leaves no sequelae then why should we still worry too much about it? 

[Huma0]

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@Nanxing0 wrote:

then why should we still worry too much about it? 

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Well, because we are worrying about who we pass it on to, not just how sick we are individually. That may well be someone who is far more vulnerable. Personally, I'm happy to do what I can to help stop the spread.

[Nanxing0]

@Huma0 That is absolutely a valid point. Again as a scientist I am not anti-vaxxer and I suggest everyone to get the vaccine whenever possible. However I do respect those who have valid concerns and decide not to take it. People have different situations. I have a few friends who have had serious side effects shortly after vaccination and they are hesitant to take the booster due to it. It's essentially a balance between gains and loss. Taking the vaccine is not without any loss.

[Nanxing0]

@Sarah977 This is common knowledge. One good example is the flu shot -- it's never perfectly effective. The most effective years the flu shot is only 60-70% effective while in some years it can go down to ~20-30%. Reason is simple -- the vaccine development only "predicts" the actual variant that is going to massively circulate, while the actual circulating variant is most likely different than the one that vaccine targeted. When you contract the virus, it's most likely the one that circulated.

Essentially, vaccine is like a drill performed to our immune system.