Ring Doorbell

[Michelle53]

Hi all

I just installed a ring doorbell at my guest space. Yes, I have it in my listing description, and have the "security camera" option checked.  It is, most definitely, an exterior camera. 

My very first booking after that shows guests bringing in an extra person. 

My maximum occupancy is four, due to fire code, and five people came in at 4.30am. 

In one sense, it felt a bit weird to be able to observe this, but in another sense, I'm glad I have documentary evidence, now, of rule breaking.  

Before, I'd have to observe beds, dishware and towels used, to know if extra guests were brought in. 

My house rules are posted inside the front door, so nobody can claim ignorance of the rules. 

This was one of those groups that I had to chase down by phone and text, to read the entry instructions, and confirm arrival time.  They do have prior good reviews, so not a newbie. 

I'll be sending a claim for the extra person, with a note about non-observance of house rules, but they have been very quiet (obviously still sleeping), and I'll have to assess the state of the space after they check out, to decide if it's a case of being willing to host them again. 

Thinking about it more, it's also a really helpful tool to know exactly what time people check in and check out.  I was also able to see they left the gate open. If I walked by the entrance, I would normally lock the gate if found open. Now I know when I have to do it. 

[Gordon0]

I think you're in the right, @Michelle53, but tread carefully so you'e not biffed with a retaliatory review. 

[Michelle53]

@Gordon0  Thanks  !    It's not the first time I've had people bringing extra guests in. I've had mixed results trying to get them to pay up, since I charge a per guest fee. Mostly, if they communicate at all, they claim ignorance of the rules. How hard I go after them sometimes depends on other factors, like general communication and cleanliness of the space. Usually, I'll save my review until the very last minute (partly thanks to reading other host commentary on retaliatory reviews, and also to give myself a chance to cool down). 

[Trevor243]

@Michelle53  When you charge different rates for a different number of guests, you are discounting. And of course, you're finding out that more guests than paid for keep coming. And then you're trying to chase for extra money or reporting people for breaking rules etc etc. We charge a price per night for the property, regardless of whether it's 1 or 8 people there. We don't have to stress of 4 people coming instead of 2, we never have to chase for extra money, and we never have to report people for breaking rules. Have you considered saving yourself the hassles??

[Michelle53]

@Trevor243  Hi Trevor, the short answer is "yes, I have considered that exhaustively". 

We're likely in two completely different markets. I mostly get one or two people. Larger groups are infrequent. I particularly do not want to encourage groups that want to pay one price but stuff as many people as possible into the space. Especially, since we are now going to get "pot tourism". Fire code states a maximum occupancy. I could get delisted if a neighbor complained. 

Also, each person costs in terms of : laundry, hot water, electricity, soap, shampoo, toiletries, and general wear and tear and breakage. 

I would ask you : since you allow up to 8 people for one price, what would you do if someone brought 10 or 12 people without your approval ?   Deny them entry, write it off, or charge for the extra guests ?

A maximum is a maximum, and house rules are there to be followed. 

[Trevor243]

@Michelle53The properties we manage are generally for between 4 and 8 people. As a typical example, a property might have one double bed, two single beds and a sofa bed, so will sleep 4 people in beds and 2 on a fold out sofa bed.

We're on a holiday island - the vast majority of our guests are on holiday. We get a handful of guests who are visiting family, and some have travelled from Australia, New Zealand, Canada etc to be with their family.

In the UK, children cannot be taken out of school during term time (39 weeks per year), which means that most of our guests through the year are couples, rather than families. School holidays are always fully booked with families and pricing is normally at least twice as much as early season (March might be £50 per night, August might be £120 per night). Therefore, income is higher when properties are more likely to be fully booked.

However, there are times where a group of adults, for example, a couple with elderly parents, will travel and stay together, so sometimes a property is fully occupied outside the peak season. This isn't very often, so nothing much to worry about. And sometimes, we get a booking for 2 people, but they often sleep in separate beds - parent and (adult) child, siblings, work colleagues etc.

We always price for full occupancy. If a property is fully occupied, we get paid the right amount. If it's under-occupied, that's a bonus for us. We are always prepared for a full set of laundry on every booking.

We provide the bedding for the fixed beds, but not the sofa beds. We provide exactly the same "other things" like toilet rolls, tea and coffe etc, for every booking, regardless of whether it's 1 person or 8 people staying. We don't provide towels, other than a hand towel in each bathroom, which is the same for every property, regardless of the number of people staying. Our pricing is based on this maximum occupancy so we can't ever be out of pocket if a booking is for 2 people but 4 turn up. Nor will we have the hassles of having to argue with guests or chase for extra money.

Each property we own or manage is insured for a maximum occupancy. Sometimes that maximum will be 4, sometimes 8 etc. I advertise the maximum occupancy. I don't actually meet my guests normally, so wouldn't normally know if guests have exceeded maximum occupancy. If they do exceed the maximum occupancy, that is a breach of the insurance limits. We will still be insured for our properties, but the guests will not, because it is them that have broken the rules. If I did see more than the maximum in a property, I would have to ask them to leave.

[Robin129]

Part of @Michelle53 's concern is a violation of fire code regulations. It isn't just money. If something happened and the authorities determined it was over occupied she could have a legal issue.

I would suggest two things. 1) include the maximum number of guests in your very first correspondence, even if they don't book. 2) set your "additional guest" fee astronomically high, like $100. 

Setting the standard rate on the basis of full occupancy may not be  bad idea. Also, if you see them bring in extra people I'd call them immediately and let them know. It will be uncomfortable the first few times but that is better than dealing with the authorities. 

[Melodie-And-John0]

@Michelle53 , I feel your pain,  We have employed variable pricing on our 3 bedroom suite for a long time to encourage single or couple guests to book without them having to pay like they were sleeping in all 3 rooms and thats increased our overall bookings and especially 1 & 2 person bookings.  We also accept both instant book and self check in so many times we never even meet our guests, if we observe an overage of guests, we ask, explain and request them to update the booking, sometimes that works, sometimes they dont update it and others just leave the cash on the table to cover it.  That said, occasional folks either miss that detail or are just trying to get something for nothing.  In the end, getting more bookings than I would if I charged everyone max and choosing my battles carefully have worked out well for the most part.   Good luck, John