Discrimination?

Jennie131
Level 10
Rapid City, SD

Discrimination?

My house rules state that my house is not suitable for children under the age of ten. I have checked both "Not Suitable For Infants" and "Not Suitable For Young Children" buttons. Guests don't bother reading house rules or listing descriptions. Guests still send a booking request with infants and children on the reservation. When I tell them the house is not suitable for infants and children, they almost always become hostile and combative. 

 

The other day I had such a booking request. I asked him to retract the booking request, because the house is not suitable for small children, and he had two small children on the reservation. He argued and became hostile, but then he did retract it. I DID NOT DECLINE IT, HE CHOSE TO RETRACT IT.

 

This morning, I received a nastygram from customer service telling me that I am guilty of discrimination for declining a reservation that included children, and this is strictly not allowed. I was warned to refrain from discriminating against guests in the future. 

 

My house is not safe for young children, and my insurance company will not allow me to host children under ten years of age. 

How can I avoid getting penalized in the future?

39 Replies 39


@Anonymous wrote:

@Jennie131  The wording of the discrimination policy is purposefully vague on this:

 

Age and Familial Status

  • Airbnb hosts may not:
    • Impose any different terms or conditions or decline a reservation based on the guest’s age or familial status, where prohibited by law.

 


 

but hang on, don't hosts discriminate against 18yo (young adults, uni students, etc) all the time?  

@Gillian166   Yes, and it gets even weirder because Airbnb has two age groups for profiles:  18-24, and 25+.  If you're in the former group, the host is notified when you send a request, and you may be automatically blocked from booking an Entire Home property within some radius of your location. 

@Gillian166 I think agism is generally applied against the old and not so much the young. In our brave new world the young are becoming more vocal about politics and in the future who knows maybe more and younger age groups will vote. There is and always has been legislation about the age of 'responsibility' and thats the age of licence for all types of things including credit cards and the ability to sign contracts such as booking an Airbnb. Discrimination is personal and particular , such as someone deciding that as a woman you cannot get a bank loan ,even though you qualify, because you do not have a husband. It is about exclusion on the basis of personal unchangeable characteristics.Except in exceptional circumstances adults are responsible for children and that is not a transferable responsibility.Adults sometimes overstep and expect as in Humas case ,the owner of an Airbnb to take responsibility for their young person on their say so, because they do not see a drawn line or because in their home life they make those decisions for their children . Thats normal but when a credit card comes out and the 18 year olds are partying on Daddys bucks then they again cross a line.Its up to us to say no.As Andrew points out if an exclusion takes place based on color ,ethnicity, gender etcetera it is easy to see.Other things not so much. There is such a thing as adults only and age appropriate and these things are already covered by laws.How many laws we need is always up for debate and laws change. Some countrys allow 14 year old girls to marry but we might exclude a young pregnant female from our Airbnb. Is she a child ?Most definitely yes but ......I know this is not what any of you mean but this could be discrimination but is it?Probably. The whole world wants to get into our houses and our homes . We are in charge of who does . Be firm but kind. H

This is important to think about for all of us because we are 'the doorkeepers' we exclude people all the time. H

We all have something called 'at my discretion'or the 'exception ' H

Mark116
Level 10
Jersey City, NJ

@Robin129  That's not a bad idea, @Jennie131  could put in the listing that any guests who book despite the warnings about safety and the note that it is unsuitable for children have to sign a waiver agreeing not to sue, and make the waiver as long and detailed as possible.  That could put off jerks who want to rent a property that is unsuitable for them

"Amateur Lawyer-ing" is very common these days, but it really does fall in the category of "spreading misinformation", and although this forum exists for us to help each other - we really have to stop at the waters edge of what we absolutely know we are putting in print about the law.

"have them sign a waiver....."    

saying what exactly? If I jumped the gun and you were leading up to a solution that perhaps showed an example of language or how to obtain or secure a signature of such a document (all of that fraught with more legal issues) - the I am sorry to speak too soon. 

 

I don't think the advice is helpful, and I know why. The creation of such a waiver could actually increase the hosts liability and vulnerability on several fronts.

@Sherry346 signing 'waivers'is as you say fraught. Sometimes people in Australia wave these under peoples noses and say 'sign here' . Basically they try to cover insurance problems with their personal indemnity insurance as in 'he said or she said' they would not sue. The bottom line is simply tell people your place does not accept children . It is in your rules if they care to look and you hope they can find somewhere lovely to stay as many others around about do. Same for pets sadly.I accept children but not pets. Its bottom line a choice you make . Dont explain it . dont legal it up just treat it as part of your business. So they made a mistake in booking . So what? Discrimination is a different matter all together. Its not legal here in Australia and we have strong laws against it H

Huma0
Level 10
London, United Kingdom

@Helen744 

 

It should be as simple as that, but it's not. As a host who does not accept children, I totally understand what @Jennie131 is saying about guests becoming hostile.

 

Before I switched to long term hosting, I would often have people requesting to book with children (sometimes also bringing their guest count to over my maximum), even though it was clearly stated in my house rules that I don't accept under 18s. 

 

As we know, many guests do not read the listings/house rules. You would think that when you point out that unsuitable for children is stated on the listing that they would simply respond, "Oh sorry, my mistake. I didn't notice that. No problem, I'll withdraw the request." However, the majority don't.

 

Instead, they try to twist your arm and it's usually something along the lines of, "But MY child is very well behaved/mature/an angel." They basically want you to disregard your rules because their child is always the exception. When you won't, they get very upset, as if you have said something nasty about their child, which is of course not the case.

 

I've had one guest who repeatedly tried to book for herself and two teens (even though the max occupancy was for two guests). When I told her that my other guests booked their rooms on the assumption that there would be no children in the house (the point that usually worked with others wanting to bring their kids), she responded that one was nearly 18 anyway and that the other was tall, "So no one will notice." As if that's the point! My rules about children/maximum number of guests were irrelevant to her. Some people simply want want they want and your rules are meaningless.

 

Another lady basically told me that there was something wrong with me and that I must be some sort of twisted person if I didn't like children. I never said I don't like children. I do. That's not relevant. The rule is there for several practical reasons, as is the rule about no pets. That doesn't mean I hate children and animals! 

I don't agree - get a lawyer to draw it up if you have to - this kind of clause has saved me many times in my dealings with renters over 20+ years.

Your listing is not prepared or suitable for children.  If they want to book anyway they must sign a waiver.  BOTH parents not just the booking parent.

 

Sherry346
Level 5
Dania Beach, FL

Young children, the law, and appropriateness.

 

We have at our very large listing and split duplex/triplex home been accused of :

 

- Running a brothel inappropriate for children

- Discriminating against families for not allowing 2 adults with 2 undeclared children into a room with two twin beds and no room to walk.

 

- Since it was a "shared bathroom" we then have another couple legitimately furious about sharing a bathroom with children, while they are on their honeymoon.  The complain, (rightfully) to airbnb about "listing not accurate" 'dishonest information" etc. This is grounds for suspension on it's own.

 

- Couple #2 now is eligible for a full refund + relocation costs to the "nearest possible similarly priced" - which is 5x the cost due to holiday/weekend pricing.

 

- two couples do it? 8 people in a bathroom.

 

- Host is at fault and wrong in every conceivable way with no options. 

 

SOLUTION: Our owner is a photographer of boudoir and tasteful nudes.

 

They are now ALL OVER the home and many warnings are mentioned and they are IN THE PICTURES of the property. 

 

A muslim woman in Hajib called us an abomination, but otherwise it's working. 

Oh my goodness! That sounds like a mess!

haha @Sherry346 great idea 😄

I've seen an Airbnb listing where bathroom wall tiles have comic book nude motives. I was surprised by their choice at first but soon realized it must be chosen with the intention to reject families with kids  😄

Linda1556
Level 2
Sarasota, FL

I also have a no children rule at my small bungalow due to a safety hazard - as the doorway opens immediately into the pool area and I don’t have child gates.  

Guests not only don’t read the listings, they argue with me about why they CAN bring their infant-they aren’t walking, they’ll be in a pack-n-play, etc.   There is just enough space for two adults and no space for additional furniture items.  

 

I’ve encountered this numerous times…and had to report for harassment as they wouldn’t take “no” for an answer. Totally ridiculous

as soon as you say no, they want it even more.  no is no.  block the dates and move on.