To clean or not to clean!

[Robin4]

While I do not justify exorbitant cleaning fees, I have come to the realisation through, not just being here on the Airbnb CC but, on other sites I am active with, many guests are unhappy with having to pay a 'cleaning fee' and don't realise why they have to!

I host through Airbnb and I have a $15 per guest stay cleaning fee. As you all know that is not a per night fee it is a once only fee for the duration of the stay. I would say to many guests 'Would you consider that ridiculously high?' But some guests consider that even that fee should not be charged!

The second thing is, there is a difference, hosts don’t expect guests to clean the property, they just don’t want the guest to walk out and leave it like a pig-sty! No host expects a guest to prepare for the next reservation to arrive.

We don’t expect you to wipe down the walls, the counter-tops, attend to those coffee cup rings on the bedside and occasional tables, checking for insects and spider webs.

We don’t expect you to strip the bed and remove those blood, alcohol or makeup stains from the linens, put them through the washing machine, dry them and iron ready for a future guest.

We don’t expect you to wash the towels and provide new face-washers to replace those that were destroyed by nail polish remover, acne treatment cream and fake tan lotion.

We don’t expect you to remake the bed with fresh linens and put out a new set of towels and face washers.

We don’t expect you to vacuum the carpets, rugs and steam mop the floors.

We don’t expect you to clean the toilet, shower alcove, sinks and taps.

We don’t expect that you will wash, dry and put away the dishes, cutlery, saucepans and glassware that you have used.

We don’t expect you to restock the fridge with a cheese plate, milk, eggs and bacon, fruit juice, a beer and a cider and water from the re-stock facilities.

We don’t expect you to test that the TV, the fridge, the hot water, the DVD player, the air conditioning filter, the washing machine, the smoke alarm, the microwave and hotplate, the electric blankets are all working!

This is what we charge a cleaning fee for! To return the property to the state which the guest enters it in.

We just expect you will put your rubbish in the bin, pick up those used nappies and condoms that were left under the bed and dispose of.

Put furniture back the way you found it.

Leave the property in a relatively tidy state.

That’s all we expect!

There are certain overheads that must be covered in order to provide a listing in the first place.

There is a property mortgage to be covered, insurances, council rates and permits, maintenance, breakages, gardening, electricity and gas, water the constant supply of condiments……..This is what you pay for in the listing amount.

It is most unfortunate that many guests do not seem to be able to differentiate between the two!!

The listing amount covers the cost of supplying the property. The cleaning fee covers the cost of continuing to offer it to guests!

Cheers…..Rob

[Robin4]

@Alon1 

Geez Alon, I really don't know where you come up with some of these funny ideas of yours.!

Ok, here is a screenshot you or I will see if we do a search of my area....are you up with this?

It shows my listing price as $90 per night....go on Alon, click on it, and that is what you will be shown. It will not show my cleaning fee or the Airbnb service fees, or any local government fees......all it will show is what I basically charge per night.....without any extras.

I seriously don't know how I can spell this out any better....I have to admit defeat, I have done my best!!!

[Alon1]

@Robin4 

Geez Robin, I just clicked on your profile and listing.

Firstly, it comes out in French.

Secondly, YOUR LISTING PRICE IS NOT ADVERTIZED!

Only the message:  'Ajoutez des dates pour voir le prix' 

Which of course translates 'Add Dates to see Price'

I can best speculate there is more than one system, perhaps something to do with EU directives about displaying entire nightly price. 

What other 'funny ideas' do you think I have?

[Alon1]

@Robin4 

ps. I've also just checked on line Mount Baker, Australia.

You are right that all the listings have nightly prices below them.

This is contrary to checking London, UK, which does not have prices. 

Likewise, Paris, Barcelona and Berlin which I've also just checked.

However, Budapest & Bucharest, nightly prices appear.

Consequently, it may not be EU but there are evidently different systems applied to different locations. 

[Hollie6]

Whenever I search for a property it always shows the nightly rate but not the break down of other charges such as cleaning, taxes etc until I look at the calendar. It must be different for you for some reason. Maybe it is the UK. I live in the USA but have stayed in other countries and it still shows only the nightly rate as Robin stated.

[Juan63]

We all maybe seeing different things, on my end I see the nightly price and the total right below before I even click on a listing. That total price includes the cleaning fee.

[Susan1404]

@Robin4- I would love to have the cleaning rates you quote.  I live in a very rural area and the one and only time I priced having someone clean  my two bed/two bath cabin, the cheapest rate to be found was around $180.  The highest quote I received was $235.  There is no way I could make money and pay someone to clean at those rates.  I remember having my personal home cleaned for about $100 back around 2001 or 2002.  I couldn't touch that low rate now.  I do understand a $180 cleaning fee and while I think it is high, that is what the norm is in much of the U.S.  I'm sure there are some cheaper ones somewhere, at least I hope there are, but not anywhere near me.  I myself have been charging a measly $15 to do the cleaning myself.  After my most recent guests, I'm either going to go up on my nightly rate or charge a higher fee. 

[Robin4]

@Susan1404 

Yeah Susan, I know I am lucky where my cleaning situation sits!

I could not possibly pay for a professional cleaning company to do my turn-arounds, It would almost double what I charge! As it stands at the moment I charge $90 per night, my cleaning fee is $15 and the Airbnb service fee to the guest is $14.50 so that means the guest pays $119.50 to stay one night here, and $103.20 for subsequent nights. Guests think that is good value, I make around $70 per night and everyone is happy!

But that is my situation, and I know that other hosts have vastly differing scenarios to mine.

The ironic thing about this cleaning help I have Susan, when I was with Meals on Wheels this woman, Fran, worked in the kitchen as a volunteer helper a couple days a week. She is the loveliest woman but she was totally shameless when it came to borrowing money! Every week she would say..."Can you spot me $30 till next monday?" She always repaid it the next week but, on Friday the request would be repeated. Sometimes it was $50, sometimes even more, and I didn't feel comfortable about this week after week. In the end I said to her one day..."Fran why don't you come and clean my cottage between guests a couple of times a week, I will give you $30 per clean"! She jumped at that and has been doing it for the past year, we have a bottle of bubbles and a chat when she finishes, she and Ade get on well together...... and she hasn't borrowed any money since!

Real win/win!

Cheers......Rob 

[Susan1404]

@Robin4- I need to find a Fran like yours.  I've been looking for someone to just assist me so that I don't spend the hours cleaning like I have been.  I'm sorry to say that people are truly lazy.  No one wants to work and I was willing to pay around $20 to $25 per hour to assist me.  Teens don't want to do it nor do young adults.  I would have jumped at something like that when I was younger.  At any rate, I'm happy you found a good cleaner and you no longer have to spot her any money. :=)

[Paul663]

I charge a cleaning fee because I consider that just upping the nightly rate instead would be hiding it - it would also penalise those guests that stay more than one night.   The fact is that short bookings cost the host more than long bookings because of the time/cost of cleans after every guest.   To me, the best way to reflect that in the pricing structure is through an explicit cleaning charge.   I think most guests understand the issue, and what they focus on is the total cost - over the whole period of their stay.

[Sarah977]

@Robin4  The thing is, I don't think guests think things like this through at all. Or they just don't really do much cleaning in their own homes and so have no idea. I've even read some posts by hosts who say it takes them 30 minutes to clean a studio apartment, which I can't imagine would actually end up being very clean.

I posted an answer to a guest the other day who said she objected to being asked to do basically anything if she paid a cleaning fee, and asked what would there possibly be left for the cleaner to do if she washed her own dishes, and stripped the bed and cleaned up the kitchen. I sent her an extensive list, pretty much simlar to yours. She ignored my post and then posted her objections again furher down the thread.

[Robin4]

@Sarah977 

Yeah Sarah, I am finding that too. I can't really think of a solution. You can't just set a listing amount that includes the cleaning fee because, what that fee will be on nightly basis will vary depending on the length of a stay and does not reflect a nightly charge! I don't know how else Airbnb can do it, but as you said, lots of guests just don't accept it!

That is why I started this thread, I know it's like taking 'Coals to Newcastle' putting it here, but some guests will see it and I am putting this text on other sites where very many more guests will see it!

As far as cleaning time is concerned, I find it impossible to clean my Studio in less than 1.5 hours Sarah....and even then I will probably miss something. I allow 2 hours, and that will include stripping and making the second bed.

Every 4th stay I have a woman in to do the complete turn-around for me, and she is really good, she takes everything out of the drawers and wipes them thoroughly, polishes the cutlery, toaster, makes sure there are no ants in the sugar bowl, no millipedes under the bed or the couch  and, she does a really good job, and only charges me $30. With me doing the in between 3 stays that equates to a bit over $7 average per stay which doesn't break the bank! I know I am fortunate to have this deal and most hosts cannot expect to get their listing serviced for what I am paying, but if hosts would seek out a retired able bodied person in there area who needs just a bit more cash, I am sure they would find one without having to resort to professional cleaners, and the amounts they charge. Fran gets $60 per week from me and she is more than happy with that.......and I am more than happy with what she does!.

But I do not condone hosts who set cleaning fees that do not reflect the cost of cleaning. I came across this one not long ago..........

To me, this is just being dishonest, and this is why guests get stroppy about paying a cleaning fee!

Cheers......Rob

[Sarah977]

@Robin4  Yes, I'm not sure how hosts could think this wouldn't p*ss guests off. What's the point of luring in guests with what appears to be a reasonable room fee only to have them see that the cleaning fee is almost as much as the nightly fee? It's like they think guests are stupid or don't see that they are being tricked.

That's so interesting about your deep cleaner. I've often thought that tapping into the retired seniors demographic woud be a great way to find a responsible, dependable cleaner. So many of us older folks are still just as active as we were 30 years ago, and many would love an opportunity to earn a bit of extra cash, especially if it's right in the neighborhood. And they would also be pretty flexible with scheduling.

And there are also serious, responsible teens who might not know how to clean well, but are fast learners, and if they have the motivation to earn some money (maybe they're saving for college if their parents can't afford to finance), they could also be good.

[Rowena29]

The thing is @Sarah977 , in some locations it DOESN'T **beep** guests off. all they care about is the final  total, especially if they are staying more than a couple of days where the cost of the large cleaning fee is defrayed  over 7 days or so. I'm exactly in this scenario myself with my listing.   we need to charge a certain daily rate to make ends meet - pay off our mortage etc.  I do all my own cleaning to minimise our costs. the clean, washing linens, making beds takes me at LEAST 8 hours.  I add an extra $50 to my daily rate ( a 2 day stay minimum) and then discount stays of 3 days or more to offset the extra (cleaning) charge. The extra $50 per night does not come close the reflecting the amount of hours/labour put in.  We just break even/slightly ahead  most of the time, especially as we frequently just get weekend bookings.   A home near us ( they own their home outright so no mortgage)  charge about$120 per night regardless if there are 2 or 10 people staying. their cleaning fee is $280 (what they actually pay their cleaners). For  3 nights or more,  for 5 -6 guests or more, they work out cheaper than us - they are packed into bedrooms  like sardines I think, but they're cheaper, and they are usually booked out. They get great reviews and are superhosts.  And the hosts AREN'T tricking the guests - the cleaning fee they are charging is their genuine actual cost they are paying their cleaners.  Just think - if it takes you 2 hours to do a room, how long for 4 bedrooms, 2 or 3 showers, 2 toilets, 2 lounges, a kitchen, a dining room, possibly a deck or patio etc etc.  Plus all the beds made. Plus all those sheets and bath towels and beach towels washed,  They make themselves attractive and competitive by making their daily rate, IMO,  ridiculously low.

[Sarah977]

@Rowena29  Oh, I get it as far as how much time is required to clean a big place that sleeps lots of guests. I certainly think hosts need to be reimbursed for this, not be doing it for peanuts.  I raised 3 kids in a 4 bedroom house, I don't have any illusions about how long it takes to clean. I was specifically referring to the listing that Rob posted- if you notice, he has input 1 guest and the cleaning fee is $323. That seems ridiculously high to me. 

I just don't like click-bait. If I were a guest, I would be really irritated if I saw a cleaning fee that was almost the cost of the nightly room rate, if not more. And there's been many, many posts from guests here, not just the ones who don't "get" cleaning fees, but the ones who understand and are willing to pay one, but hate the "making themselves attractive and competitive by making their daily rate ridiculously low", but actually making their profits on the cleaning fee.

[Rowena29]

Sure @Sarah977  a cleaninng fee of $323 for ONE guest seems ridiculous, but isnt' that a lack of flexibility of the listing tool? the cleaning fee doesnt' vary with the number of guests, it's a flat fee. So if a listing can sleep a big number - say 8 or 10 ( which I imagine the listing Rob provided does) the cleaning fee doesn't seem SO ridiculous.  And as a consequence the host is very unlikely to get a 1 guest booking  -  more likely to get full occupancy. ( Maybe I should employ this strategy. I seem to get a substantial number of bookings for 2 or 3 or 4  -all wanting a room each, when I can sleep 😎

And yep, I''ve read those same guest comments and I fully understand where they're coming from.  I personally would be put off by such a huge fee and such a big disparity between the nightly fee and cleaning fee but the point I was trying to make is, that is my area there are lots and lots of listings EXACTLY like this, (who aren't marking up the cleaning fee, just passing it along, substantial as it is),   and they do the best business  as far as I can see - very high occupancy and great reviews.  So it's obviously working for them.  I" be interested to know though how considerate their guests are in terms of being neat and tidy. I think a huge cleaning fee would be a big  pyschological barrier to that.