New security camera policy is unreasonable

[Conrad76]

I presume all hosts received an email from Airbnb about security cameras, in which it says, "You’re not allowed to have cameras that monitor indoor spaces." That is completely unfair. The basic Abode security system that I have has a motion sensor with a camera that takes a snapshot if the sensor is triggered when the alarm is on, to get a picture of who or what is moving in the hallway. I disclose this in my listing, and I have a small curtain that guests can pull to cover the camera if they are concerned about privacy. Airbnb is essentially forcing me to get a different security system. How are other hosts dealing with this?

[P41]

I had posted the same issue, but in a different topic here on the forum, so I will copy paste my opinion here as well : 

Hello fellow Hosts,

I received an update today saying security cameras inside the apartment would have to be removed.

I was wondering how other Hosts feel about this because to be honest, in my opinion, I think it's a bad thing.

I rent a private bedroom in my apartment in Paris and for MY own security, I installed a camera. I had so many issues with unauthorized guests throught the years that I started to feel unsafe inside my own apartment. Of course the camera was following all of Airbnb's rules, such as being marked on the listing, with it's location being in a common, not a private area (it's in the hallway, facing the entrance door).

So when having guests check-in, specially with the lockbox, it was a huge relief to see that the person coming in actually matches the person that made the reservation. 

Unfortunatelly,  I've also had many scenarios where at 5 am the guests staying in the bedroom actually opened my apartment door to an unauthorized guest to come in. I saw this in my camera notification the next morning. As a woman, alone , living in the same apartment as I'm renting a private bedroom (max of 2 guests), to wake up and see that there are 3 men on the room next door is really not a good thing but at least I was able to see that through my camera and ask a friend to come over and help me handle the situation, instead of just opening my own bedroom door and being surprised by this scenario. 

A lot of people are just disrespectul of the host's house rules and space so the camera at least gave me a minimum feeling of security inside MY own apartment and now Airbnb wants this camera to be removed and I don't consider this right at all. In cases like mine, it's for the host's own protection, since I live in the property, and for the protection of the host's property as well.

On another note, as I mentioned, my apartment is in Paris and French Law authorizes survaillance cameras on rental properties in accordance to some rules and as long as the tenant agrees with it. So if I put it in my House Rules (which the guests have to agree to before their reservation is confirmed, therefore, giving me their consent) tecnically it should be accepted by Airbnb, no?

Stay safe, (or at least try to, without a camera, now)

Paula

[Joseph2139]

Absolutely unreasonable - a camera should definitely be disclosed and its up to the guest to decide if they are ok with that or not. Especially with indoor cameras facing entrances and with no "private areas"  monitored. 

[Ana2038]

In my situation my security cameras are only on the perimeter of my primary residence. There are no security cameras on our Airbnb unit which sits behind our primary residence. Airbnb made me disclose the presence of security cameras on my primary residence years ago even after I explained that our Airbnb unit does not have any security cameras inside or outside of the unit. 

The email also states I need to disclose the location of outdoor cameras. I'm not disclosing the location of the security cameras on my primary residence. My listing already states the security cameras are on the main residence (perimeter of the house) only. I've have reached out to customer support/service to get clarification as the last thing I want is to have my listing suspended. 

[Boris374]

I think that they are just referring that this new set of rules to be followed for listings for WHOLE properties only, not to listings for individual rooms that share common spaces with other people (like hosts who rent their spare rooms within their own house). If you read it again, you will notice that it never mentions anything about shared spaces. Unfortunate wording, though.

[Jency2]

I wish that were true but unfortunately, their email says "Please remove any indoor cameras, disclose the location of outdoor cameras, and disclose noise decibel monitors to comply with the updated policy."

[Steve2584]

Maybe this is why I didn't get any email regarding a change to indoor cameras. I live in the same house where my private room listings are. I don't have a "whole house" listing, so no expectation of complete privacy outside their private room or shared bathroom exists. The platform recently stated it's desire for "room" type listings.  I would never put cams near bedrooms or bathrooms. I work from home, with dogs, and have 1 indoor camera, disclosed in the listing details, in the shared kitchen that I must use for taking dogs outside. The cam allows me to ensure the kitch is unoccupied when doing this and keeps guests safe and able to enjoy undisturbed food prep. Guests must acknowledge the presence of dogs (having no direct contact with any) before booking. Disallowing this safety and guest comfort/enjoyment feature is just wrong. Guests would definitely prefer me knowing they are in the kitchen, than suddenly having 2 or 3 dogs appear at their feet or grabbing their food. My respectful camera WILL NOT show anything that myself or up to 2 other guests might see at any moment when not in our private rooms. This needs to be adjusted and clarified in the policy wording. With "whole house" listings, an expectation of having NOBODY OTHER THAN THOSE YOU BOOKED WITH be able to see that you're cooking rice and beans on the stove, is appropriate. If as many as 3 people that are essentially strangers to you could knowingly walk in to the kitchen as you cook is possible, then a respectable, safety ensuring camera that can show the home owner and full time resident the same, should not be banned. 

[Beijing2]

I totally agree.  Banning indoor cameras rules should NEVER apply to listings for individual rooms that share common spaces with other people (like hosts who rent their spare rooms within their own house).  

I rented individual rooms to multiple Airbnb guests.  I have encountered some bad behaving Airbnb guests entering other guests or host room without permission, one Airbnb guest taking food from other guest without permission, one registered Airbnb guest bringing multiple unregistered unpaid friends into my house, smoking cigarettes and weeds, and playing loud music in midnight, with other Airbnb guests texting me in midnight complaining of loud music and smoking.  I have multiple Airbnb houses.  If I don't have indoor cameras for commo areas, how can host collect evidence and pinpoint the culprit Airbnb guest in violation of policy and law?

[Filippo489]

I'm sorrt but it does mention shared spaces, I rent just a room and the camera is not in the space I rent, but talking with the support they clarify that I have to remove any camera from any indoor space in my propriety.

[Minguang0]

totally agree. if some one want to use hidden camera to sneak on the guest, they will used it. the new policy will do nothing to help resolve this. but on the host security will be negative impacted.

[P41]

Exactly, if this was Airbnb's attempt to stop with hidden cameras it's a total failure because the bad hosts that do that will continue to do so and the good hosts that follow the policy and use cameras for their own safety will be punished. 

[Jency2]

I think this new policy is unfair and unsafe to hosts.

Here in NYC we are only permitted to do STR where we live.

I only feel comfortable doing it because I have ring cameras in the hallways, the kitchen and my daughter's art room.

I do not want to remove it from the hallways because:

1. My outdoor cameras are not reliable. It picks up every passerby and every car but doesn't always pickup when there's a guest at the door. I rely on my hallway camera for accurate notification when someone enters my house. As much as I try to pick good guests, at the end of the day, they are strangers in my house & around my family. So many have tried to enter doors they no they shouldn't enter. God forbid something goes wrong, I need proof.

2. so many guests leave my doors wide open & never say anything. I only know when I get an alert from my indoor camera. The outside camera always misses it. If I have to remove my hallway camera, anyone passing by could just walk in.

3. When I 1st started airbnb, I had damages & theft. I only received reimbursement for a tv stolen by a guest because I had proof from the hallway camera (the outside camera missed it). 

4. Too many guests have tried to sneak in unregistered guests. I have to be careful with this because NYC maximum guests is 2 or risk getting fined.

I do not want to remove the camera from my daughter's art room because:

1. it can't be closed off & there are too many guests touching her belongings. They only stop because they remember I have the camera. I have nowhere else to move her stuff. 

2. I get a notification when they try to open the door to my daughter's bedroom. There's big sign on the door so they know it's off limits but, the still try to open it.

3. If someone goes in her bedroom, or damages her stuff or takes something, I want to be able to look back and see who did it.

The kitchen camera helps:

1. when people forget stuff in the fridge, I can go back & see if it's my kids or if it was a guest.

2. When I found a bunch of food in the sink, I was able to go back & see who did it (it's not a garbage disposal).

3. When I saw slimy stuff in the sink drain, I was able to go back & see, someone hacked up thick spit in it. I knew I had to take extra precaution, clean/disinfect/sanitize even more than usual. 4. more importantly, if I need to, I can see when someone is trying to access the bedroom right next to the kitchen, it's off limits to guests. 

I don't know what to do. I'm ok getting rid of the kitchen camera. I'm not ok getting rid of the camera in my daughters art room. I don't feel safe getting rid of my hallway cameras.

[P41]

I totally agree with you Jency, I've had similar experiences with guests acting in bad faith and I will definitely not remove my security camera. It's for MY own safety inside MY apartment. If the Law of the country where I live allows it, why does Airbnb think they know better...

[John5097]

I think they are changing their policy because allowing cameras inside ads to the perception of hidden cameras.. I was surprised Airbnb allows them inside at all to be honest. I personally don't have any cameras and haven't had any issues. I can appreciate how some home share host use them for security in common areas. I would think they would still be allowed in areas that are off limits to guest, such as host or host family private bedrooms, but would need to check. You can still have them outside, door bell, or over the entrance. Vrbo also doesn't allow cameras inside. I like the change as I don't want guest to think there are cameras inside.  

[Reina173]

Don't like it...typically during the week we rent out rooms and the weekends we rent out the whole unit which is attached to another living space (long term renter). We have one indoor camera for the kitchen and living room. Without this I wouldn't have caught the guest who clogged the sink, broke the microwave, damaged the floow, had additional guest, left the door ajar,  smoked, took items had a weapon! These were all different guest mind you...and we only accept guest with positive reviews so these were not "low level" guests. This also ensures guest do not enter our long term renters living space. Many times before providing video footage abb would say they could not accept the claim, this is after showing pre-checkin video which we always take... This policy I hate...and i hope they change it, guests can simply just choose not to stay at a place with cameras...

[John5097]

Another host made a post here complaining that guest were giving his listing lower reviews because of camera inside. He also didn't state cameras were inside the property in the listing description, and also just had a vague "Living Room Dining Room Outside Property" under the amenities which led some guest to think they were outside. Airbnb policy stated that the cameras inside needed to be made very clear in the listing description, which would be "other thing to note" or "about this space". 

I haven't had a kind of issue or made a claim in over 4 years. I also accept all guest, many without any reviews and their first time using Airbnb. 

Sorry but not properly disclosing inside cameras, watching guest like a hawk and declining guest with no reviews doesn't help other host.