My son has been banned, but we can't understand the reason.

[Anthony1251]

My son (a third year university student) has been banned from Airbnb for "soliciting third party services" we are at a loss to understand why. He is studying film at university, and for his third year project he has to produce a short film, for this he needs locations to film, it can't be at relatives homes etc as he needs to prove he can get all the proper permission. For his film he needs an outside (seaside) location and an interior location (near the sea). He has got an outside location and been approved for filming there so he started to approach the owners of a few Airbnb's to see if they would give their permission for a group of six students to film in their properties. He wasn't asking for a reduction to the price of the properties, in fact the group are more than happy to pay the full price to film for a few days. I am struggling to understand this ban, it has seriously affected his ability to create a final year project. Can someone help?

[Anthony1251]

@Sarah977 only one person who replied gave a reasoned possible answer, the rest of you have been mildly abusive, to say that asking for permission to film at a property is akin to asking for a handjob at a massage parlour, or that he was clueless to even ask, or that I shouldn't try to help my son to try and understand this move as he can't ask the question himself because of the ban, is quite frankly abuse. I just hope the majority of hosts who have replied are more courteous to their paying guests than they are on this message board.

[Marit-Anne0]

@Anthony1251 hiding behind privacy rules, it is very unlikely that airbnb will reveal the reason for the suspension of the account other than what is already given. It says something about "third party" - could it be that your son has previously booked on behalf of others ? If so, that is against airbnb t&c. Assuming he has had previous airbnb stays and reviews of course. 

Hosts are usually not insured for other than providing accomodation, so declining a film or photo shoot is to be expected.

[Anthony1251]

@Marit-Anne0this is his first time using Airbnb, he created an account specifically for this. I can completely understand hosts not wanting filming happening in their properties, but it's very easy to say no, with no problems at all, as apposed to what appears to have been someone flagging him.

It's just frustrating to try and get an answer as to why from Airbnb, they don't appear to be open to people asking questions.

Thank you for your answer.

[Emilia42]

@Anthony1251 I highly doubt any host flagged him at all. As I said in my first post, this has happened to me where someone messaged me to ask about filming. Before I could even respond to the message, Airbnb suspended/deleted the user's account. I received a message from Airbnb stating that I had been in contact with someone who was violating their terms of service and their account has been removed. About 20 minutes later, another user messaged me (part of the same filming crew) and tried to ask the question again. Once again, Airbnb removed the account. Their algorithm obviously picked up on something in the message. Probably because Airbnb's are intended for use as overnight accommodations and not venues for filming (whether hosts agree to it or not.) Your son learned the hard way that algorithms usually prevail and there are many times no way around them. My advice to your son would be for him to create a new account (using a different e-mail address) and use Airbnb solely for the purpose of having a getaway with his partner/family/friends. Find another avenue for securing filming locations.

[Robbie54]

@Anthony1251 if this is your sons first time using Airbnb  I feel you're making a rather large meal of the situation. There are plenty of other platforms who host properties, why can't your son try one of them and move on?  

[Anthony1251]

@Robbie54 I only asked a question on his behalf as he couldn't ask himself due to the ban, for that I was called clueless, a helicopter parent, and various other slurs. Airbnb is the largest platform, he is, and will continue to use other platforms, all I tried to do was maybe try and find out why.

I suppose this community is no different to any other "social" platform...full of people willing to make stupid comments based on nothing.

[Robbie54]

@Anthony1251  totally agree. 

[Helen350]

I sympathize with Anthony & fully understand it's perfectly logical to ask Airbnb uses what they make of a bizarre & illogical suspension/ban. After all, the CC exists to connect users/ask questions/gain clarity....

I'm baffled by the suspension. Hosts who hang around here seem to think there is an unwritten rule that guests may not book for commercial purposes. Which makes sense; it's an accommodation site, after all. BUT I've searched the information pages & can't actually find any clause which disallows filming or other business, (&student enterprises are study, not business?)

@Anthony1251 Here is a recent thread where a) a host laments damage done by a work bubble filming b)  hosts who posted here on your post say they have not found the rule that filming is not allowed.

https://community.withairbnb.com/t5/Hosting/Claims-for-guest-damage/m-p/1398331 

(just reposted link, which seems to be working now!)

[Helen3]

Hello @Anthony1251 

Can you or your son not ask one of your personal contacts or a relative if they have accommodation they can use. They would need to get the same sort of permissions that they would need if he used an Airbnb i.e. provide a copy of their liability insurance, liaise with local authorities about any permissions needed, having a contract with the owner regarding filming permissions and usage, so I am not sure why his university would not accept him doing so.

He could of course also try other listing companies.

It is against Airbnb's terms to book accomodation for purposes other than a residential stay. Perhaps that's why it was flagged? The reality is that if a host accepts a booking for non residential purposes they would normally charge substantially more than the standard accommodation rate even if it is for student filming and if they are savvy would need him to provide liability insurance, a contract for usage etc.

I can't agree that a single listing provider saying he can't ask it's hosts to have him film at his listing is impacting on his ability to complete his project. There are plenty of other options open to him such as asking family, friends and using other listing companies. Ido hope your son finds somewhere post Covid lockdown.

[Anthony1251]

Thank you @Helen3 he has to be able to prove he got all the proper permissions as part of his film, and prove they got insurance etc, he has been told by the university that he isn't allowed to use property that is a friends or a relatives, the university actually advised using Airbnb for this purpose. His group have had to raise finance for the project, so budget is an issue, but if a property owner asked for more then that's obviously something that they would try to take into account. It just seems wrong to me that Airbnb would ban someone for purely asking the question about filming, this ban affects any future holidays he may want to take and is not a good advert for Airbnb.

[Helen3]

The Uni is being stupid and unreasonable- your son needs the same permissions and insurance whether he rents the home of one of your friends or rents an Airbnb home. @Anthony1251 

I used to manage filming requests when I worked from a major London  borough so have some understanding of this issue. 

[Kelly149]

@Anthony1251 you've made the common mistake of assuming that ABB is a thinking, rational being whose every decision will make sense. It is not. This is not personal to your son. These things just happen at times. ABB says that they'll reinstate accounts even after criminal activity after some time has passed. I'm sure at some point your son will be able to rent an ABB or even if not, there are other booking channels (many many many properties are on multiple platforms) so he has plenty of options. You can keep after CS for as long as you have energy, totally your decision.

[Nathalie-Et-Gilles0]

@Helen350 

Guests cannot book for commercial purposes because it is forbidden by the building rules AND the city rules.

Living appartement are for living only.

No commercial action is allowed.

The fine is up to 50’000€ here.

@Anthony1251 

i would have definitly flag your son because his request is a big breach in the contract.

I do not even speak about adults films and porn films.

It happened with some « artist » guests who did not want to pay the price of a professionnal unit.

[Helen350]

@Nathalie-Et-Gilles0 I agree it is against the SPIRIT of a  short term rental residential letting platform to allow commercial use. - Goes without saying!

BUT, can you find anything in the terms of service/help pages which explicitly state this? - I've looked, and can't find.... It would be helpful if there were such a thing, then hosts could direct guests to the relevant paragraph, rather than merely sounding unaccommodating, n'est pas?

What you say about building rules may apply in France, but be different in other countries, especially private houses, not in blocks of flats? - Tho' in the UK commercial use may go against a host's insurance. Then again, if the filmmaker is staying the night, what they do in the house during the day may or may not be of consequence?

Anthony's son was wanting to make a STUDENT film.... I doubt he'll be earning any money from it! So maybe that is less of a commercial endeavor, and more akin to an art student doing a painting, or any student writing an essay during an Airbnb stay? 

I'm surprised you'd report such an enquiry! Would you STILL report a filmmaker, especially a student, if you knew this could get them banned for life? - It was an innocent mistake, remember, with an appropriately expressed polite enquiry, and no ill intent, we presume?

[Robbie54]

@Nathalie-Et-Gilles0 

"Guests cannot book for commercial purposes because it is forbidden by the building rules AND the city rules.

Living appartement are for living only.

No commercial action is allowed.

The fine is up to 50’000€ here."

Irrelevant to the conversation. This is the UK, not France.