Am I being unreasonable?

[Tiana1010]

Hi everyone,

Feeling at a loss with my current guests -two young female fashion students from India (21 and 24). They are renting a double bedroom at £30/night.

The first week was pretty tough as they basically completely took over the kitchen, but I did object and things have improved.

However they are constantly at home and seem to go to their uni about half a day a week.

A few days ago, I stipulated that they had to be out three days a week. Today their course was cancelled and they came straight home. I wasn't very happy and pointed out that they could go to a cafe or library to work this afternoon. They objected to this and said I am being unwelcoming. 

Breakfast takes about 90 minutes, dinner about two hours, washing up is never put away, bathroom is soaked after they use it, make up on the sheets, etc etc.

That's without mentioning the boiler that was unplugged during their first week, or the front door that was left open.

Am I being unwelcoming? I guess I feel they are expecting too, too much from a cheap airbnb. I have given them a month here even though I knew ten days ago they made me uncomfortable, because I know they are going to find it difficult to find anything else. Regretting it!

[Jessica-and-Henry0]

@Huma0 

Yup.... she completed her stay (just barely) - she wasn't a bad person but was really not a good fit with us and completely clueless about basic manners and etiquette.

Henry was so exhausted by then that we were thinking about taking a break the next semester........ but Covid happened and we've been closed for the past 2 yrs which worked out okay for us since we both also ended up having to stay home more and not go out as much 🙂 

[Huma0]

@Jessica-and-Henry0 

Well, sorry to hear you did not get a chance to host a stellar guest after that one to restore your faith! Still, it's good to take a break sometimes. Not that COVID was a good thing for anyone, but one has to adapt to the circumstances and make the best of it.

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@Jessica-and-Henry0 wrote:

@Huma0 

she wasn't a bad person but was really not a good fit with us and completely clueless about basic manners and etiquette.

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This is the thing though. When someone seems like a nice person, it can seem too harsh to crack down firmly on their behaviour. One of my current guests does all manner of things that annoy me and she's not the best at following instructions, but at least she tries to clean up after herself and is certainly not the messiest I've hosted by any means, so I just take a deep breath and carry on. The guest you described though. Mmm. I am not sure. I don't think I could cope with that for too long. I do, after all, have other guests staying, so it's not just the stress of having to live with that mess, but the stress of having other paying guests be unhappy about it.

[Huma0]

@Jessica-and-Henry0 

PS, I like your house rules. They are probably a similar length to mine, i.e. longer than most, but I feel like you have covered a lot of bases (including things that I have not managed to cover), it is worded very clearly and professionally and particularly appropriate for long term stays, although most of it is relevant for short term too. The only bit where it is potentially a bit vague (for un-housetrained guests like the one in your post) is what cleaning up after yourself actually means, as this varies so much from person to person. 

For example, one of @Tiana1010 's grievances about her current guests is that they do not put away their dishes. Actually, this is a very common problem for me. Guests either put things in the dishwasher (but only a tiny percentage ever think to help empty it occasionally, even if most of the dishes inside are theirs) or, more commonly, they hand wash them, but never really think to put them away, meaning there is no room for anyone else + I end up having to do it for them. I have grown tired of this. While I am still the one emptying the dishwasher, I simply decided not to put guests' dishes away for them anymore. I just pile them up on the counter and most of them actually get the hint! Sure, it might seem passive aggressive to some, but they were reminded already so I'm not going to nag them about it every day. 

I haven't actually gone into that kind of detail in my house rules, but I will mention it during the tour of the kitchen, as the majority of guests never think to put their stuff away. Much like they just pile their recycling around the bin when it's full, they either just expect me to do it for them or that some sort of magic 'dish fairy' pops by to do it.

[Jessica-and-Henry0]

@Huma0 

We also cover a lot of detail during the house tour and the first few days of the stay - especially what "cleaning up after yourself" means for us. And sometimes we will point things out, other times we liked to leave notes which can be seen as passive-aggressive, but we always tried to word them nicely, add a smiley face, and make it more of a *gentle reminder or suggestion* that isn't face-to-face because we didn't want to seem like we are constantly chasing after them to tell them what they need to do. 

Henry actually preferred to put dishes from the drying rack away himself (we don't have a dishwasher) because he could inspect and make sure everything was clean. Oftentimes, Henry ended up re-doing the dishes because they were slippery with food grease or still had food bits stuck on them. Similar situation as you for recycling. For the guests who did a good job all around and were easier to live with, we would invite them to join us for dinner more often, share meals/snacks frequently, and have more of a *roommate* relationship with them while for those who required more work, we'd keep our distance and just cover the basic hosting duties. 

We only hosted one guest at a time, compared to you we had it easy~~~ 

[Huma0]

@Jessica-and-Henry0 

Yes, the house tour is really important. It's not just an opportunity to welcome guests, help familiarise them with their surroundings and let them know where to find this or that, it allows me to reiterate some house rules in a friendly manner. It's often easier for guests to digest these when you are showing them the space than when they read it prior to seeing the listing. 

[John5097]

@Tiana1010 

You could create a schedule and in house rules state guest need to reserve a time slot limited to one hour per each meal in the kitchen. Include this in your other things to note.

Seems unreasonable to rent a room and use the kitchen for hours at a time.

Your rates may be very reasonable for your area yet way more than guest home area. 

Asking guest to leave three days a week after they arrived is unreasonable. Although you could also state in your listing when some areas of the house is available for guest. 

I think when someone chooses to host they need to be mindful of guest needs. I find that guest love rules and instructions. I think it gives them a sense of independence so they don't need to contact me for anything and enjoy their stay. 

[Tiana1010]

@Huma0 , @Jessica-and-Henry0 , @Sarah977 , @John5097 Thank you all for all this help. I have been working on my rules  today and have stolen a few of yours  that I particularly liked!

I am still in two minds about kitchen time. I'm not sure how to word it, and I don't think having a time slot works. I  would hate to  have to do my cooking at a certain time. I'm caught between only wanting very minimal cooking in there, and wanting to be a bit more generous, and let people cook one/two meals a day. Hmmm!

@Jessica-and-Henry0 , yes i completely agree  - the problem is when the guest is quite nice, but still really annoying in lots of small ways. You don't want to be mean and unwelcoming, but their presence does cause undue stress... it's so difficult!
I have changed my max stay to 14  nights for now. Seems much more manageable (although the bulk of my enquiries have been for one month plus, so will have to see how it goes). 

A couple of  you seemed to imply you could see the guest/talk to them via Zoom before they arrive - do you mean once the reservation is confirmed? Surely by then it's quite awkward to change your mind??

Thanks  again everyone, you've inspired me to start to deal with this!

[Huma0]

@Tiana1010 

Personally, I also wouldn't have time slots for kitchen use. It would not suit my lifestyle, nor my hosting style. My suggestions were more to do with how you might limit the AMOUNT of time the guests spend in the kitchen. It is still a bit awkward though.

I don't think you can host long term guests and advertise kitchen access but then keep it really minimal. As I mentioned, long term guests are looking for a temporary home and their day to day budget will be quite different to short term guests. Being able to cook most of their meals at the listing is very important for them. It's a deal breaker really. You also can't really tell them to go out when they want to stay in! 

I think the best thing you can do if you want to host long term stays is to be picky about your guests, i.e. only accept the ones that are going to be out of the house a fair bit. Of course, the guest's circumstances can change, e.g. you expected your current student guests to be out at university a lot of the time, but I wouldn't rely on college students spending that much time out of the house.

If you want long term guests who are going to be out and about, you need to pick:

1. People who are employed full time and do not work from home, but are required to go to a work place five days a week. This can include people doing internships, or visiting academics.

2. Doctors, nurses and other medical staff coming to do rotations near you. They usually work long hours. This can mean a day job, but it might also mean they work some night shifts, so be prepared for them to often be home during the day, although they will be sleeping for much of the time! I find this category make excellent guests.

3. People coming to do short courses that are full time and intensive, which means they will be at their place of study all day. These are professionals coming to do English language courses.

However, you will find with all of these that they are highly likely to use the kitchen and many will cook proper meals if they don't like ready meals and take aways. There's no way getting around it with long term guests. You just get lucky sometimes and get one that doesn't like to cook!

[Huma0]

@Tiana1010 

RE the Zoom thing. I haven't done this. I did an in person meeting/tour with one guest and a long phone conversation with another, but Zoom (or similar) would be a useful way to do it. Yes, this is after booking. Sure, it would be awkward to then change your mind and there are cancellation penalties involved, unless it is an instant booking and the guest makes you feel uncomfortable/you think they will break your house rules, in which case you get three penalty free cancellations a year.

Those examples were to put my mind at ease about these long stays because I was new to hosting in my own home and also because I'd had a few nightmare housemates before that. I am not sure what you would do if there was a problem. You could tell the guest that you don't think it's a good fit for them and refund them, but you'd have to get Airbnb to refund their fees, which makes it complicated. 

These days, I just try to get as much of a sense of who the guest is prior to accepting (or within the first 48 hours of an instant booking) and that includes an idea of their schedule. I do accept guests who work /study from home, or might not even be working at all, e.g. they are relocating to London and job/flat hunting, or they are 'slow' travellers on some sort of sabbatical, but this is the time to find out.

[Steve2888]

I'm in a similar situation where I feel the guests are being disrespectful of my house rules. Not sure what to do about it, but I want them to leave early.