Month-long guest has checked out and is demanding a partial refund.

[Christiana1]

Hello all! I am having a very difficult time with a very difficult woman.

An airbnb user booked my apartment for her parents for a little over a month (so I offered a 50% discount), during which time she had a baby. She was easygoing at first, then as the reservation date came up, she became more pedantic and irritable. I assumed it was because she was about to have a baby, so I tried to placate her and respond as quickly as I could to all of her questions (which were about 5x a day for a week and a half).

They checked in and broke the lock on my front door. They threatened (in a very rude way) to cancel the reservation if the lock wasn't fixed before the end of the day but also complained of having nowhere else to go as no apartments were available nearby. I didn't need any threats to get the lock fixed by the end of the day, but I think they thought throwing a tantrum was the only way to get my attention. I would have fixed the lock whether they had been rude or the paragons of politeness. I had the lock fixed, emailed them to let them know, and heard nothing back.

Three days later, I get another complaint that the apartment is "disgusting, dirty, and unliveable." They also mention they have nowhere else to go and are stuck. As I'm already familiar with their overreactions, I offer to have a professional maid service to come in a clean, if they wouldn't mind letting her in. They are not comfortable with having a stranger come in to clean. I offer to have a trusted friend of mine to come clean (as I am not in town) if they will just let me know what precisely they want to be cleaned so I can make sure they're happy. I also tell them I have a few friends who host, though their apartments are nearly twice as expensive as mine, and I offer to get them in touch and perhaps get a discount, since they're staying so long. I hear nothing back.

Three weeks after check in, I contact the airbnb-user-new-mom to make sure everything is ok with the apartment and if she would like a maid to come in. I hear nothing.

I messaged again three days before check out to see when her parents are planning to leave and wishing them the best on their journey home, and congratulations on her having a baby. She responds with:

"Hi Christiana - we were extremely upset and disappointed with the apartment. It was very dirty and run down. We took pictures of the furniture and the dirt accumulated. My parents couldn't even sit on the sofa! The stains, the dust, the bugs!The place needs to be completely renovated! With the birth of the baby, the unexpected C-section, complications with the apartment, it has been an extremely stressful month and not the experience we paid for. I will be contacting Airbnb to place a formal complain and request a partial refund. We paid a lot of $ for an apartment that is not suitable to live in. Let me know if you want to work this out between you and I. If not I will initiate the process with Airbnb and seek legal advise as well. Thanks."

I was surprised, to say the least! I asked her what exactly she would like for me to do to make her happy, and she responded that she would like a refund of $1290, which is a little more than a third of the total  reservation fee. I feel like that's far too much to refund her, especially as I was trying to be as helpful and accomodating as possible. My cleaning fee is $40, so I thought the least I could do is refund that, though it seems like a slap in the face to her.

[As a little backstory, my boyfriend and I deep-cleaned the apartment from top to bottom two weeks before she arrived. We bought new sheets, dishware, pots and pans, and semi-renovated the bathroom. It looks even better than when I moved in, so I am absolutely sure the apartment is not as dirty as she perceives it to be.]

What would you say is fair in this situation? I want to make her happy but I don't want to be taken advantage of.

Thanks for reading and for any advice you can give me! She checked out three days ago so I want to get this squared away as soon as possible.

-Christiana

[Keith1]

Assuming your pictures are accurate, they had no reason to expect the Ritz-Carlton.   They got a bargain on the room and expected the world.

I generally caution against discounting mostly for this reason.  When people are lazer focussed on price they will always expect more than they pay for.  they're tring to get the most value (in their mind) out of every dollar they spent.

The fact is, they shouldn't have stayed a month if they were this uncomfortable.  they used your place the entire time and they should pay for it.  had they left after the first day they might be entitled to a refund.   They did have other options, I'm certain there are many hotels in New York they could stay in if yours wasn't suitable for them.

They broke your lock, they should have to pay for that out of their deposit.

If you're worried about a review, then I'd sit on this and wait out the 14 day review period and hope they forget to review you.  then just let the matter drop.   Reject any refund request, but wait as long as you can so they don't retaliate with a bad review.

If it's not too late, you should submit a security deposit claim for the cost of the lock repair.

Keith

[Bernadette0]

I agree with you Keith on this.
Also, if it was that terrible why did they not contact Airbnb head office with their grievances immediately and submit photos the first day?

[Michelle0]

Hi, Christiana! 

As a 3-year host myself, and a team member to Cityami (a NYC airbnb cleaning and guest care concierge), I would say I also agree with the above. This is very unfair of her, and if she did indeed break the lock, she should pay for it (hopefully you saved a receipt and filed a complaint within 48 hours?). She also should have left the very first day if she was unhappy. Airbnb's policy only allows her to receive a refund if she arrives, finds your home unacceptable, and leaves within 24 hours. If you don't refund her, you might receive a bad review - but you will also have a chance to respond to it publicly (and you should). If everything you say is true, she won't have grounds for legal action.

That said, there are a few things you can do to ensure this doesn't happen again. First, set the impression well from the beginning. At Cityami, we like to leave a welcome basket for all of our guests. We know this is costly, but it makes guests feel welcome and expected. Second, hire a professional to clean. We rely heavily on our cleaners as we know they see things we as hosts don't - even small details like making the bed professionally and dusting the base boards go a long way. 

Also, please keep in mind that guests coming from outside of NYC can frequently have expectations that money holds the same value in NYC as it does elsewhere. Unfortunately, as we all know, it does not. You can set the expectation appropriately by uploading new pictures of your space, but also mentioning in your profile that the building is older. 

All of this said, if you're ever looking for help hosting - don't hesitate to reach out to us at Cityami!

Happy hosting!

[Isabelle3]

I feel your pain,  The AirBnB resolutionn conflict team is very good and will work with you for a reasonable compromise.   I had an issue with a guest - not as bad as yours but unpleasant and they came to my dollar offer instead of hers.

[Kelly3]

@Michelle0

'Also, please keep in mind that guests coming from outside of NYC can frequently have expectations that money holds the same value in NYC as it does elsewhere. Unfortunately, as we all know, it does not. You can set the expectation appropriately by uploading new pictures of your space, but also mentioning in your profile that the building is older.' 

I like your comment about NYC and reminded me of a standup comedian's line.

"NYC people come over to my place and tell me that I am a succesful comedian living in this kind of place.

People from outside of NYC visit me and they cry."

I too host in a older building in a big city, I can totally relate - some people think it is a bargain for this location and privacy, some just don't get it.

[Deborah0 · Accepted solution]

@Christiana1, if what you say is accurate, you are dealing with an extremely unreasonable person, and perhaps a scammer.  For a guest to perceive that an apartment which has been deep-cleaned is "very dirty and run down", suggests either a highly distorted perspective, or an intent to perpetrate fraud/scam by making false claims.  I find the part in the guests' communication regarding how guest will ostensibly seek "legal advice" to be quite telling.  This is a good clue of someone who is a scammer/bully -- it is one of the tell tale signs of bully scammers that they are not interested actually in getting problems resolved, but would rather file claims for $ afterwards and go about threatening legal action against others.  

The fact that this guest made such a fuss about the place needing to be cleaned, but then would not let you send someone to do any cleaning, even though you apparently offered to have someone come and clean 3 different times, makes clear to me that this guest had no interest in actually getting any perceived problems resolved, or anything that was ostensbly dirty, cleaned up.  No, it seems to me that this guest has more interest in bullying and threatening you than she ever had in getting any problems addressed.  

I would respond to the guest by summarizing for her all that you did during the stay to attend quickly to all problems the guest complained about -- the lock, the cleaning issue -- and indicate that if she chose to stay while refusing to allow you to address any perceived problems, then she has no standing to file complaints afterwards and demand a refund.   LIke Keith says, guests can't stay the whole time and then also ask for a huge refund claiming the place was not satisfactory.  Offering to refund her the cleaning fee is a good will gesture, but that is as far as I would go.  No way should she be refunded 1/3 of the whole reservation cost.  You might indicate that if she was so unhappy, she should have cancelled the reservation right away.  As Keith says too, some guests just do not understand the concept of Airbnb, being that they are going to stay in someone's actual home, which is not the Ritz Carleton.   If people are very unhappy right away, it is a very good idea to get them to cancel and find another place to stay, since having guests who are unhappy throughout a long stay is unpleasant for all concerned.   

Another issue comes to mind --- the fact that the woman you are referring to and who made the reservation, seems to not be the one who actually stayed at your place. Her parents did, as I understand it.  For that reason, I question whether she has any standing to make any complaints at all. SHould she make a complaint to Airbnb, you should inform Airbnb that she didn't actually stay at your place, her parents did.  I don't know how that would be handled since technically third party bookings are not allowed.  But for someone who never stayed at your place to be demanding a refund, threatening legal action, and writing a review -- all seems wrong.    

[Ruby1]

Yep. I'm gettitng the "scammer" vibe too...

[Tammy2]

you need to learn to be your own orbitrator, and think "what would the majority or reasonabl person think".

any reasonable person would know youre being scammed.  Upon entry, if a person doesnt want to stay somewhere, they go else where and then negotiate a refund.  Air bnb has his host at a grave disadvantage in that it takes its non refundable fees but entertian guest request for refunds as to protect their client base.  Stand up for your self as tell the customer, that any resonable person would have accepted maid service when the room is dirty. (i.e. hotels) If they dont want strangers i the room, then they have elected to live with the conditions.  (its a common sense situation)

HINT:  he who has the strongest paper trail wins.  Always tell the customer to communicate official information via "Air bnb message site"  so that an official record can be compiled.  The customer only sent you complaints because they intended to screw you. (by way of paper trail)  they also threatend you with Air bnb because they know they'll listen .....

They said they had no place to go becasue they intended to stay all along.... other places to stay, is not your problem if they dont like your place.

send the request for help from the community to Airbnb immediatley... contact Airbnb immediately with  your problem and ask them to help yo, and that you want to make a formal complaint and to be paid for yor lock from the deposit, or request Air bnb to block thier profile if they refuse to  pay for your damages.   There is no such refund after check in with "strict cancellation policy"  change your cancelation policy to "strict " under air bnb setting...

quick!#@$%^ act now!

***

tell me all of your problems...

my sister lives in NYNY...shell slap them for ya....hahahah

[Lizzie]

Hello @Tammy2,

Great to see you taking part in this discussion and providing advice. I just wanted to let you know that I have edited your post for your own safety as it contains your personal email and telephone number. Just remember to keep in mind that your post is publically visible, more details about this can be found in the Community Center guidelines. 

@Christiana1, thanks for posting this, I am sorry to hear about your situation. It is great to see you are recieving a lot of advice and kind words from the rest of the community. As this has been several days since you posted last, has this been resolved now?

[Maxine0]

@Christiana1 - your other reviews are a mixed bag. Some happy, others clearly not - including others with issues concerning the lock not working before this guest and with issues regarding cleanliness. Airbnb will see those reviews too.

I agree with others that she should have contacted airbnb much earlier and they would have given assistance to re-house the guest with another local host if she felt she really felt it was 'unlivable' - you don't stay the entire month and then seek a substantial refund.

One thing I was confused by was whether she gave birth while living in your apartment? If so you should be wary of what others have written about birth tourists - that is people who want to give birth in a specific location to claim citizen rights etc - if that was the case, her motivation for staying a month of yours was very specific and for the price she was prepared to pay - and now her mission acomplished (to have the baby in your location) she wants to get money back at your expense.

I would not give any refund to keep her happy - she's never going to be happy whatever you do as her interests are not you but instead (unless she gave birth after she left) having her baby in New York

So don't respond further but instead suggest she directs all communication through airbnb. You already gave a substantive discount for the month booking and sought to address her concerns as soon as she contacted you, which she was obstructive about - such as not wanting a cleaning company to come in - what was she afraid of them seeing - was it too 'official' for her liking?

Airbnb are quite adept at seeing between the lines and she's unlikely to take matters further if she is herself trying to hide something

[Christiana1]

Hi @Lizzie! Thanks for your kind message and your help moderating the board. I have not heard anything back yet from Clara, so I'm just waiting until the review period is over and I can breathe easy again. Guests like this make me never want to host anyone!

[Annie7]

Christiana, it seems to me you had a bad experience, but that you handled it exceptionally well. You were tactful with your difficult client; and the bit about the 3rd party guests is really weird, indeed. There is no reason in the world why the parents should not have signed up (with daughter's help if need be) and booked the place tehmselves. It is a basic tenet of Airbnb that the we (hosts) know about the people coming to stay because of the verification and feedback systems. You did well in seeking the collective wisdom of the Airbnb community, and there are probably some lessons you (and we) can learn from the experience (that's why it's called experience 😉 ). So my hope is that you will not let it darken your attitude to future hosting, but concentrate on what you can do to continue make hosting work better and better for you, and for your guests. Good luck!

[Patricia95]

Christiana, you'll get a few of those in a lifetime. I went through the same thing once with a guest.  Fortunately, it was the first and last incident in my hosting history. Good luck!

[Donna3]

@Tammy.  I don't think you can change to strict cancellation,  I think ABB removd that option.  If you had it before they changed their policy, they honor it, but if you are new you cannot use it.

Anyone else ware of this?

Good luck.

D